Upupa Epops said:... and sound of PCB's, chassis, screws, wires, distance pads... all tested with CD as source.... in the end you will discus about noise difference between blue grass and green grass...
rightly said.no point discussing so called "SOUND DIFFERENCE" between different metal film res. a metal film res. has better noise margin bec of its inherrent topology.jus like a bipolar electrolytic has differences from metal films(@lower values),same is the case with m/f res. and carbon.
so a manufacturer claming his res to be superior to competition on flimsy grounds using alien terms,,;;i would better use my common sense than fall into such a trap.
i strongly agree with chrisr.better spend on other high quality thingies rather than useless and worthless expensive components that serve no other purpose then to inflate the bill.
but chrisr,,havent u noticed that use of polyester caps in signal path improves performance if replaced in place of bipolar electros.
point to be driven home is that same is the case with m/f and carbons.
its not the cost but the materials that causes such difference.
i know their is a very real differance between electrolytic and poly caps but again i use common sence. only poly types in the signal path but kept at a minimum and to use dc coupling where ever possible. again i like good quality parts but nothing fancier than what digi-key offers. it's always good design over *bling bling* parts.
this site has some very subjective people on it who know how to build good stuff but fortuneately for me their are also people here who build , test and measure and build great stuff. i was just reading about slow recovery diodes in the power supply section and to my delight was provided hard numbers, that i like. i think their is always room for improvement in active devices but i do have one exception, op-amps, they make good enough ones for $5 as compared to the *bling bling lol* $18 one with just slightly better spec. ah well i like discrete designs but will use an op-amp if need be.
if only a manufacturer would emphasise best of breed design using just quality parts, not the *bling bling* so it could be more affordable and justifiable to buy that what the current hi-end is. i can't afford $9000 for a for a 50 wpc class-a amp but would gladly pay $1000 for one that had the same design. this is why i DIY.
mid-fi uses the cheapest parts and usually (small psu's, cc resistors, go right to the limits the of output devices or worse yet use class-h or some other nasty design in a power ic package). at the other end you got the ultra hi-end unneseccary $6 resistor products and after you tack on the 60% margin your starting at the >$5000 range.
my wish is that a mid-fi manufacturer would make hi-fi like products, to start maybe a 7 channel gainclone amp and sell it for $250, after all they make 5 channel recivers with dsp chips and all that junk for $400, shurly they can make my amp and even turn a good profit on it. after all i think every audiophile knows about the gaincard now and word of mouth plus it's reputation would sell that amp. thats just one example i could come up with more.
but all this is just wishfull thinking, untill it happens i'll be looking for that middle ground(DIY).
this site has some very subjective people on it who know how to build good stuff but fortuneately for me their are also people here who build , test and measure and build great stuff. i was just reading about slow recovery diodes in the power supply section and to my delight was provided hard numbers, that i like. i think their is always room for improvement in active devices but i do have one exception, op-amps, they make good enough ones for $5 as compared to the *bling bling lol* $18 one with just slightly better spec. ah well i like discrete designs but will use an op-amp if need be.
if only a manufacturer would emphasise best of breed design using just quality parts, not the *bling bling* so it could be more affordable and justifiable to buy that what the current hi-end is. i can't afford $9000 for a for a 50 wpc class-a amp but would gladly pay $1000 for one that had the same design. this is why i DIY.
mid-fi uses the cheapest parts and usually (small psu's, cc resistors, go right to the limits the of output devices or worse yet use class-h or some other nasty design in a power ic package). at the other end you got the ultra hi-end unneseccary $6 resistor products and after you tack on the 60% margin your starting at the >$5000 range.
my wish is that a mid-fi manufacturer would make hi-fi like products, to start maybe a 7 channel gainclone amp and sell it for $250, after all they make 5 channel recivers with dsp chips and all that junk for $400, shurly they can make my amp and even turn a good profit on it. after all i think every audiophile knows about the gaincard now and word of mouth plus it's reputation would sell that amp. thats just one example i could come up with more.
but all this is just wishfull thinking, untill it happens i'll be looking for that middle ground(DIY).
lemme see.
practical thinking.good.not distracted by so called "audio grade".audio grade cables
god help those who fall in trap.u will like this,one expert's opinion.http://www.sound.westhost.com/cables.htm
its an excerpt from Mr Rod Elliot's site,a genius,probably running the most successful diy site on the web.he is one practical man who likes to take all NECESSARY and not UNNECESSARY precautions to make his equipment sound exemplary.unnecessary means useless fancy and"BLING BLING" components.necessary means proper safety,use such components that work within their SOA in the ckt etc etc.
his article on cables sustantiates his thoughts.any person who can diffrentiate between right and wrong can learn something from his article.must read for everyone on this thread justifying fancy components that r nothing but
chrisr said:i recently got into a stupid arguement on another forum with a guy who was halking a 6' $750 power cord. what got to me was that he was using phrases like "airy" "brighter" "less distorton" "more revealing". and there were people actually buying into this crap.
There will always be sheep and there will always be people willing to operate the shears. No amount of argument will turn the sheep into something else, and you'll never get the guy with the shears to put them down. Life is too short to waste time or energy arguing over ridiculous things. You have a brain and much better things to do with it.
I_F
10% THD from a speaker isn't really high-end audio and I guess we are talking high-end audio and not standard audio.
A good driver would generate THD like this:
or like this for a diamond tweeter:
/Sigurd
A good driver would generate THD like this:
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or like this for a diamond tweeter:
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/Sigurd
chrisr said:
Nope, but why does so many cars feature super strong motors with shiny wheels and all that fanc stuff?
Is it about going faster at all?
Nope, not at all.
Cars are like a man's fortress.
Cars are much more than "cars"!
Otherwise cars would not look the way they look today.
This is deep psychology, guys!
Sigurd
Is it about going faster at all?
Nope, not at all.
Cars are like a man's fortress.
Cars are much more than "cars"!
Otherwise cars would not look the way they look today.
This is deep psychology, guys!
Sigurd
Cal Weldon said:
KT said:
Current to voltage conversion from the DAC output.
In my NOS 1543 DAC two resistors worked especially well in that position: Riken and Caddock TF020. Caddock MK132 was not really good, same for Vishay S102. And tantalum AN was barely acceptable.
Now, Riken when used with BG N 4.7 coupling caps was a better choice than TF020. Caddocks produced here rather annoying bright sound. However, when I switched to V-Caps teflon coupling caps, it appeared that Caddock was now preferred, as Rikens sounded too warm and somewhat lacking detail and less focused.
This confirms my previous findings that there is no universal choice or the best resistor. It depends on a place in a circuit and application.
To Upupa: the most expensive was no good, the cheaper one worked much better. So much for your faith theory.
Lucky Find
One day I was wandering around a local electronic surplus store. Above the 1% metal film resistor cabinet there was a small cabinet marked high precision.
Looked inside, there were 0.01% Vishay S102's. Lot of values. 50 cents a pop. Picked up a handfull. Went back a couple weeks later, picked out 120. Went to the counter, the guy said the 50 cents was a singles price. The quanity price was 34 cents each for these capacitors.
Went back a month later, my treasure trove was an empty cabinet. Someone came in and bought them all. May have gotten them for 25 cents each.
Gotta say though, these are really nice resistors. I have used them where applicable. The prices normally seen are a little scary, but in a low parts count circuit, the cost is maybe justified.
Googled the 0.01% S102. They are 14 -20 dollars each at Newark. The Michael Percy stocked ones are 1%. Even those are expensive.
George
One day I was wandering around a local electronic surplus store. Above the 1% metal film resistor cabinet there was a small cabinet marked high precision.
Looked inside, there were 0.01% Vishay S102's. Lot of values. 50 cents a pop. Picked up a handfull. Went back a couple weeks later, picked out 120. Went to the counter, the guy said the 50 cents was a singles price. The quanity price was 34 cents each for these capacitors.
Went back a month later, my treasure trove was an empty cabinet. Someone came in and bought them all. May have gotten them for 25 cents each.
Gotta say though, these are really nice resistors. I have used them where applicable. The prices normally seen are a little scary, but in a low parts count circuit, the cost is maybe justified.
Googled the 0.01% S102. They are 14 -20 dollars each at Newark. The Michael Percy stocked ones are 1%. Even those are expensive.
George
granted 10% thd might be to much but it doesn't change the fact that the speakers are still producing more thd than the rest of the audio chain combined. a stronger motor serves one function in that it usally means more torque, a good analogy would be like a muffler thats plated in chorme and that doesn't have much value when the car is like a ford taurus in design. better to start out with a design like a dodge viper, chrome optional.
some really say so,believe so,and when they do so,they really get soUND(best one).
people blessed with "AUDIO GRADE EARS" that we mere mortals are not blessed with.ears that can listen to improved performance offered only by 'airy','silver cored' etc etc components for which they spent $xyz per peice.
shinny wheels make cars go fast.i will use shinniest ones and will race ahead of all others.
dont give me normal cables,i want "audio grade" only that will sound better(cables with built in fm player)
GOD help these souls
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