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Old 5th July 2004, 10:20 AM   #1
tuneman is offline tuneman  Australia
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Default liquid nitrogen?

i am after a liquid that cannot be frozen with liquid nitrogen! does such a liquid exist?

the liquid in question will be used as a coolant that is passed through piping in a tank of liquid nitrogen, i was considering mabe alcohol or something similar but i have been told that it will be frozen as well.

its for a kind of prototype sub/amplifier cooling system, and yes i am aware of the hassles of handling liquid nitro, so any advice would be great
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Old 5th July 2004, 10:50 AM   #2
SY is offline SY  United States
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You'll be restricted to things which are probably gases at room temperature- alcohols won't do. The problem you'll run into is that anything which is liquid at 77K will have a lousy heat capacity.
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Old 6th July 2004, 02:00 AM   #3
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Well, I'm not any expert on refrigeration, but I would guess that if the volume of your coolant is greater than the volume of the liquid nitrogen in the tank by a sufficient amount, then it won't get frozen.

Also, I would think that the faster the coolant passes through the piping in the liquid nitrogen tank, the greater the chance that it won't get frozen. So the faster it moves through the pipes in the liquid nitrogen tank, the less the volume of the coolant could be compared to the volume of the liquid nitrogen in the tank, and it still won't get frozen.

I mean, the liquid nitrogen is going to take some specific time to freeze whatever the volume of coolant is in the pipes in the tank, and if the coolant gets out of the tank by then, I guess it's home free.

I am in no position to work out the necessary volume amounts of your coolant versus volume of liquid nitrogen in the tank, and at what speed the coolant passes through the piping in the liquid nitrogen tank, but I would think such things could be found on the net or your local library.
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Old 6th July 2004, 05:31 AM   #4
tuneman is offline tuneman  Australia
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thats an interesting point! thanks

i thought of moving it faster but i wasn't shure.
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Old 6th July 2004, 10:20 AM   #5
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One more question, though.

It is going to take a lot of cooling equipment and effort to keep liquid nitrogen in it's liquid state, won't it?

And you will have to move your coolant through the liquid nitrogen tank at a certain rate to keep it from freezing.

Why not just take the cooling equipment that is used to keep the liquid nitrogen in it's liquid state, and instead use it to cool your coolant directly? That way, you can buy/design your cooling equipment to be incapable of freezing the coolant at the volume you are using, and your freezing problem disappears.

Kind of like eliminating the middleman in a business deal.
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Old 9th July 2004, 09:59 PM   #6
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You could probably use some kind of oil or something like 3m fluorinert. Why does it need to be so cold? Would water cooling not suffice? You'll have to condensation proof everything.

If you have to maintain those kinds of temps, perhapse you should consider suspending the electronics in dielectric oil. You could chill the oil bath, and condensation wouldn't be a problem. I would stick to a less extreme cooling solution if possible though.
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Old 9th July 2004, 11:16 PM   #7
sss is offline sss  Israel
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Default Re: liquid nitrogen?

Quote:
Originally posted by tuneman
its for a kind of prototype sub/amplifier cooling system




it aint worth it !!!

u better use it for cpu cooling / overcklocking
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Old 9th July 2004, 11:38 PM   #8
bob123 is offline bob123  United Kingdom
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y dont you just find an old freezer and take the piping, radiator and pump out of that and run the piping through the amp, and then have the radiator on top of the amp. That would be able to keep the amp well below 0'c about -18 and would be cheap to make.
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Old 10th July 2004, 01:50 AM   #9
sss is offline sss  Israel
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also
most power transistors are working better at room temp then at 0'c (the gain is higher)
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Old 10th July 2004, 02:05 AM   #10
bob123 is offline bob123  United Kingdom
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true but the lower the temperature the less the noise due to some quantum physics type thing. if the temp was 0k there would be no noise what so ever.
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