So...I needed an 8 in 8 out digitally controlled analog volume pot for a 4 way horn speaker I am working on, so I bought a few year old Yamaha reciever for 50 bucks on CL with the intent of using multi direct in then out the pre-outs to my brace of Bryston, Adcom, and upper end Crown power amps. I thought "what the hell, lets see how this Yamaha unit soundz power amp wise while I am back here.
Sonofabitch! The truth is we have reached power amp parity and then some. And this is a unit from 2005. True I am using it for high efficiency 4 way horns, but here is the kicker. It has NO problem at all with my watt hog reference Matrix 801s hooked to zone two.
My conclusion? Obsessing over amp design is just an academic excursion. I am dead certain of this. The two Brystons etc will not be going back in the rack. Ever. Now I see why the action is over at the chip amp section, not that this is quite that, but still........
Don't shoot!
If you are curious its # RX V657, best 50 bucks I have ever spent outside of Thailand.
Sonofabitch! The truth is we have reached power amp parity and then some. And this is a unit from 2005. True I am using it for high efficiency 4 way horns, but here is the kicker. It has NO problem at all with my watt hog reference Matrix 801s hooked to zone two.
My conclusion? Obsessing over amp design is just an academic excursion. I am dead certain of this. The two Brystons etc will not be going back in the rack. Ever. Now I see why the action is over at the chip amp section, not that this is quite that, but still........
Don't shoot!
If you are curious its # RX V657, best 50 bucks I have ever spent outside of Thailand.
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Some people say you can hear the difference between amps, but whether anyone can actually discern between amps with 0.00x% distortion in a double blind test is another thing altogether. That is why I use chip amps, because I know I cannot hear any difference. (My ears are not golden, despite the acuity of my hearing.)
xx% of distortion is in most speakers. The whole consumer speaker industry ignores distortioin, with sales based mostly on the number of drivers showing. Consumer frequency response quotes are +-10 db if you buy a brand pro enough to even quote a tolerance. Radio Shack used to have a +-20 db "production tolerance" which means ablsolute **** was quoted 20-20000 hz flat response in the literature. I'm serious, I saw the production tolerance quoted in a headphone leaflet. Getting the amp from 0.X% distortion to 0.00x% is an interesing exercise but not productive driving those kind of speakers.
I spend my time here trying to get 0.x% distortion without melting a $150 speaker driver or buying something from the ***-**** orient. I've a collection of mexican TO3 transistors, obsolete GE transistors made in NY state, old junk organs, what can I build? The junk organ power amp is working as of yesterday, playing LP's from my home build mixer and rattling like a worn out refrigerator from the defrost fan Schober cooled the transistors with. The sound is vile through the Schober speaker, and I'm not connecting it to the $600 Peavey +- 3 db 54-14000 hz speakers because there is no protection. The Schober power amp has to be the world's stupidist, but it still works at 30 years of age. XX% distortion, transformer coupling between stages but direct connection of the transistors to the speaker to melt your drivers' if the fan fails.
The all npn modification of AX6 did not work, that was the story of winter 2014-15. I have the pnp-npn version of AX6 about 80% constructed. **** pnp transistors come from malaysia, I couldn't do without them. Anybody speak mandarin? At least On semi datasheets are in a language I can read.
Why don't we all just move to the orient, breath grey air, drink poison water, get beat up occasionally if we open our mouths, have our houses knocked down by the county council because they sold it to somebody rich. Work for $1 an hour unless we are someone's important son. It is the future of us all if we keep buying every **** thing imported from the Lords of commerce. Yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha I'm sick of it. I won't even sing at church anymore the equipment is all yamaha and so are 90% of the other churches around here.
I spend my time here trying to get 0.x% distortion without melting a $150 speaker driver or buying something from the ***-**** orient. I've a collection of mexican TO3 transistors, obsolete GE transistors made in NY state, old junk organs, what can I build? The junk organ power amp is working as of yesterday, playing LP's from my home build mixer and rattling like a worn out refrigerator from the defrost fan Schober cooled the transistors with. The sound is vile through the Schober speaker, and I'm not connecting it to the $600 Peavey +- 3 db 54-14000 hz speakers because there is no protection. The Schober power amp has to be the world's stupidist, but it still works at 30 years of age. XX% distortion, transformer coupling between stages but direct connection of the transistors to the speaker to melt your drivers' if the fan fails.
The all npn modification of AX6 did not work, that was the story of winter 2014-15. I have the pnp-npn version of AX6 about 80% constructed. **** pnp transistors come from malaysia, I couldn't do without them. Anybody speak mandarin? At least On semi datasheets are in a language I can read.
Why don't we all just move to the orient, breath grey air, drink poison water, get beat up occasionally if we open our mouths, have our houses knocked down by the county council because they sold it to somebody rich. Work for $1 an hour unless we are someone's important son. It is the future of us all if we keep buying every **** thing imported from the Lords of commerce. Yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha yamaha I'm sick of it. I won't even sing at church anymore the equipment is all yamaha and so are 90% of the other churches around here.
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That was the test. Matrix 801 with Yamaha reciever and Bryston. Sounds the same even cranked. This is now a dead issue for me. I am not going to "fail" this IQ test.
That was the test. Matrix 801 with Yamaha reciever and Bryston. Sounds the same even cranked. This is now a dead issue for me. I am not going to "fail" this IQ test.
Good lord no, I may be a fisherman but picking on poor behind the times "amp" people like me who didn't pick up on this is bottom feeding. There is nothing to see here, the amp thing is over. 1st class state of the art amps costs only a few bucks. I can usually spot differences in sample rate conversion but no longer in power amps. Closed issue in my mind. Just pointing it out. I will come here to silently marvel from time to time, just as I do with the "cable" people. At least I never bought that crap. So...in reply, Yep I am "stupid" enough to think that most amps including cheap recievers and many chip amps are pristine and have no sonic signature. Prouldly .
Biggest overpriced piece of amp junk I've come across to date.
Japanese manufacture, >>$10k retail, guess the brand name.
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Тhe problem is not the test, it is your conclusion. If the Bryston is the same vintage as the Matrix it desperately needs renovations. As in fact does the Matrix.
If both items are stock, any conclusion drawn on the evidence of how they perform is worthless. Not to mention that Brystons from those days were not exactly soa soundwise.
Try a new Bryston into a pair of relatively current 801s against a Yamaha and then make grandiose statements
Judging by your post history, you are over 60.
You very much enjoy horns, which are technically serious flawed (which is your prerogative to deny)
Both imply that your hearing is not accurate (a life-time of mixing and mastering is no confirmation that it ever has been, btw)
'Obsessing over amp design is just an academic excursion. I am dead certain of this'
The above is a personal opinion, not a conclusion.
Posting about your 50 buck Yamaha find on a thread is one thing.
Starting a separate thread on the matter is another, some might say ranting.
A pragmatist, maybe. Realist, very unlikely.
('can you put a price on honesty? WTF?????? I find the older I get the less I can tolerate bs, especially my own')
Guilty as charged I can't hear past 17.1k and I even fly airplanes, but I am still blessed with great hearing so far. Distortion and reverb timing are very much revealed by horns as is dynamic compression. If everyone had better speakers I would have no eed for industry standard reference B&W 801s which is typcal of all direct radiators, though very flat, they mask harmoni. distortiortion that a good horn speaker will easily expose, even to a 60 year old studio veteran.
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