I think most compression is done with a soft knee, as per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compression; so it's not obvious peak limiting in most cases. It can be quite "cleverly" done, as in Adele 21 album: if you look at the waveform at any point it always looks quite reasonable, yet the impact of the sound, subjectively, is very overbearing.
If one can work out where the soft knee was put in, as a last stage after the final mix, then the compression can be effectively reversed - the "damage" can undone to a large degree ...
What if the artist wanted it to sound this way?
Not every painter is a Robert Bateman- attempting absolute mimicry.
Compression for typical playback is a good thing, they used to call it gain riding in the studios, didn't they?
Ever hear a live Ludwig drumkit in the same venue as an unamplified piano, or guitar?
Be careful of undoing the artist's or recording engineers intent : )
Only talking about where it is "extreme", as in many current pop efforts - this is to "rescue" the recording so that one can listen to it without feeling emotionally wrung out by the end of the track; I've had a couple of successes, where it probably would not be obvious that I've fiddled with it.
Attempting to undone the compression of the capture of a single instrument, say a drum kit - probably done on multiple tracks, anyway - would be close to impossible at the moment.
Attempting to undone the compression of the capture of a single instrument, say a drum kit - probably done on multiple tracks, anyway - would be close to impossible at the moment.
Only talking about where it is "extreme", as in many current pop efforts - this is to "rescue" the recording so that one can listen to it without feeling emotionally wrung out by the end of the track; I've had a couple of successes, where it probably would not be obvious that I've fiddled with it.
Attempting to undone the compression of the capture of a single instrument, say a drum kit - probably done on multiple tracks, anyway - would be close to impossible at the moment.
Just noticed your signature- so are you a fan of Boothroyd-Stuart technology?
Only connection I see is the word Meridian, - as regards that company, more often than not the sound from their gear has not done anything for me on the day. I suspect their current active speakers would be quite competent - but an older model of such was quite a disappointment to hear ...
Seriously? It's my job to play it back unaltered?The recording engineer's job is to capture/record the event, it is your job to play it back unaltered.
Sorry, I don't see anybody paying me to do that.
John you impress with how sanguine you are at level of personal attacks you receive from some many people. Some day I hope to achieve your level . Others here have farther to go than I.
Gawd!!!
I'm being mystical ...
That's it exactly. You give the impression that there just might be something in what you say, if only the listener is open minded (I might say credulous) enough to try it.
Except to be wrong.I'm being mystical, not religious. '-) I have an open mind to many things.
Stiff upper lip old man . RegardsGawd!!!
Perhaps compression is the wrong word for turning up the volume and appying peak limiting, though it is a form of compression and quite distortive.
Limiting is just a specific type of dynamic compression just like a square is a specific type of rectangle.
You can use virtually any compressor as a limiter but not every limiter as a general compressor.
In the olden days compressor were known as 'limiting amplifiers', set the compression ratio to infinite and you have a peak limiter.
What if the artist wanted it to sound this way?
Not every painter is a Robert Bateman- attempting absolute mimicry.
Compression for typical playback is a good thing, they used to call it gain riding in the studios, didn't they?
Ever hear a live Ludwig drumkit in the same venue as an unamplified piano, or guitar?
Be careful of undoing the artist's or recording engineers intent : )
Come to think of it, that's very true. Case in point: The Nylons.
They are/were an acapella group whose vocals were highly processed, but sounded excellent.
Stiff upper lip
I thought Mr Curl was more the type to engage in a bare knuckle bar fight.
Why? Honest question.Be careful of undoing the artist's or recording engineers intent : )
I used to be that way, Jacco, but I am not allowed to be that way anymore, and so I have worked at being 'diplomatic' without giving in.
Personally, I believe in virtually everything that I have said for the last dozen years or more. Of course, I can make mistakes, like anyone else, but I have always been honest in my intentions. I really love the discipline of making quality audio, and have for the last 50 years. This 'sales' business is completely foreign to my personal quest, although I am accused of it. I just want to make better audio quality, and give away what I have found 'works' to others. Unfortunately, I can't give my latest designs away, because that is what I earn royalties from that supplements my modest social security check, but it must be understood that the 'ideas' behind my design approach are what is really important, not the specific circuit diagram, and I have tried to give them away here, with limited success.
Now, that being said, are my critics right that what I recommend is irrelevant because 'scientific testing' shows that very little really matters in linear design and that the differences are essentially an 'illusion' promoted by money grubbing hucksters trying to sell you an expensive piece of 'hot air', that does no better sonically than a piece of gear made by large volume manufacturers, at the lowest possible price?
I think that there is usually a significant difference sonically between hi end and mid fi, and I trust my own ears and experience in noting it.
Personally, I believe in virtually everything that I have said for the last dozen years or more. Of course, I can make mistakes, like anyone else, but I have always been honest in my intentions. I really love the discipline of making quality audio, and have for the last 50 years. This 'sales' business is completely foreign to my personal quest, although I am accused of it. I just want to make better audio quality, and give away what I have found 'works' to others. Unfortunately, I can't give my latest designs away, because that is what I earn royalties from that supplements my modest social security check, but it must be understood that the 'ideas' behind my design approach are what is really important, not the specific circuit diagram, and I have tried to give them away here, with limited success.
Now, that being said, are my critics right that what I recommend is irrelevant because 'scientific testing' shows that very little really matters in linear design and that the differences are essentially an 'illusion' promoted by money grubbing hucksters trying to sell you an expensive piece of 'hot air', that does no better sonically than a piece of gear made by large volume manufacturers, at the lowest possible price?
I think that there is usually a significant difference sonically between hi end and mid fi, and I trust my own ears and experience in noting it.
I thought Mr Curl was more the type to engage in a bare knuckle bar fight.
Jacco I never realized, any chance there is a relationship? The Meat Men (Tesco's first band) definitely push buttons.
"Tesco Vee (born Robert Vermeulen; 1955) is a Michigan-based punk rock musician and co-founder of Touch and Go Records zine."
You claim ears only testing is useless. This means you DON'T trust your ears.I trust my own ears and experience in noting it.
ABX is not the only way to hear audio differences.
Duh...
It is however a method whereby biases are eliminated.
You repeatedly claim that tests where biases are eliminated (iow ears only testing) are useless.
Why? Honest question.
This lounge seems to have many concerns expressed about how different CD players and amps can sound, most of which spec to -/+ < 0.5 db on playback.
Seeking to adjust the dynamic range seems against the goal most here expressed by many- accurate playback of the source.
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