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Old 25th April 2013, 07:41 PM   #11
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Just saw a gold plated optical fibre. Apparently the gold made it sound marvelous according to the salesman .
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Old 25th April 2013, 07:42 PM   #12
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OK I've got an interesting one for you.
http://www.hificritic.com/downloads/...C_Quad2805.pdf

Esteemed hi fi reviewer Martin Colloms says this in his review of the Quad 2805 ESL:
Quote:
Halfway through the listening, we thought we had got the measure of this review ESL, and then I got round to turning off the illuminated Quad badges. Operating in an admittedly high resolution reference system, powering down the panel logo had a quite dramatic effect on the sound quality, removing a certain colouration that I can only liken to the twang of a stretched plastic bag. Some excess grain and grit in the treble, by no means serious but certainly audible, also almost vanished. Clarity, focus,
image depth and dynamics were all significantly improved, to the same sort of degree as you might get by changing to a better amplifier.
What lessons can we take away from this? Never fit illuminated badges to your speakers? For me, the annoying thing is that the person who came up with the illuminated badge idea probably received a dressing down from his boss, when there may be no actual possible way that it could affect the sound. It seems like a classic 'expectation bias' result to me, but that doesn't even occur to the reviewer. Maybe he could have enquired about what it was in the circuitry that led to such a remarkable result from something so apparently innocuous.

If we are claiming that it obviously did affect the sound on the basis of the reviewer's comments, then we are bringing into question the basis of all audio design, suggesting that for all the engineering theory it is basically a lottery: fit an LED to your masterpiece and you may degrade its sound to mid-fi and never be able to track down the cause.
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Old 25th April 2013, 07:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
People always strive for understanding.
this is interesting. do you think so?
Jan Didden has this blog entry: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/blogs...scientist.html

I don't agree with it, in the sense that IMO science is NOT for the masses and there's no real gain from popularizing it. scientists should remain scientists, geeks should remain geeks, Hollywood figures should remain Hollywood figures. and not exchange places, that is. is it not intuitive? well, so what, just be good at what you're good at.
but it's obvious that some people are more rational than others and understanding is not on on everyone's list. being somewhat irrational is not bad in itself, IMO. there are a lot of thing you'll fail at being 100% rational.
trouble is when people of very different world views intersect, IMO it's rarely possible to reach a compromise.

which reminds me of a funny moment. I was talking with this girl about some random matters. at one point she tells me: "well, I gotta admit: you're absolutely right. but why won't you just allow me to be wrong from time to time?"
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Last edited by mr_push_pull; 25th April 2013 at 07:51 PM.
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Old 25th April 2013, 07:52 PM   #14
Budgie is offline Budgie  United States
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[QUOTE=Rodeodave;3468212]Ohhh, I got a good one fer ya.

"I once read that you have to regularly subject cables to DC...you know, to replace the old electrons, with fresh ones..."

I did that exact thing by accident once, but the results were not beneficial - the interconnect was still plugged in to the input of my power amp. Too many fresh electrons for the woofer...............
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Old 25th April 2013, 09:01 PM   #15
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Hi PushPull,
you already know the answer, but don't dare to write - right?

Know how is putting burden to the human mind - it's like a prison.
Limitations everywere!
Free your mind and ignore what scientists or engineers tell.
Only clean and innocent absence of know how will elevate you to the next level of human evolution.
Homo sapiens - a pretty presumptuous naming, which describes an interim fashion of the humans.
Mankind is close to the next level.
We are doing great progress in wiping out the know how, which limits our imagination.

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Old 25th April 2013, 09:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
People always strive for understanding. If they can't or won't understand the truth about a situation then they will invent their own 'truth' and firmly believe it. They may even assume that they have deeper understanding than the 'closed mind' people who actually do understand (at least part of) the truth about the situation.

I once had a dental technician try to 'correct' my understanding of quantum physics - he could not conceive of anything so counter-intuitive so therefore it had to be wrong. Lurk on here for more than a few days and someone will try to 'correct' your understanding of circuit theory/calculus/trigonometry/algebra/electromagnetism or even claim that such things are not useful for audio. Just listen and twiddle the knob (or swap components) until it sounds 'right'.

And then laugh when they twiddle too far and they jump out of their skin as the thing explodes, goes bang, or goes up in smoke.
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Old 25th April 2013, 09:16 PM   #17
sonidos is offline sonidos  United States
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IIRC, Jan said something about his master class on feedback sometimes not being understood by some people in the audience.

I ordered the DVD from elektor so I'm curious if that appears in the video.
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Old 25th April 2013, 09:21 PM   #18
badman is offline badman  United States
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Then there are the equally foolish who are dismissive of good reasoning because it "sounds voodoo". For example, directionality in cables. I always orient my cables according to the text on them. Why? Because that's how, when I assemble them, I terminate the shielding to be "telescoping". Which "end" a shield connects to can have a significant effect on the performance of said shield, I generally find best results when the shield is connected at source, but some people have found them better (for noise performance) connected the other way around, or terminated at one end with a capacitor, or, or, or.....

The point is to be sure that you fully understand what you initially react to as nonsensical, before you dismiss it 100%.

I tend to be more accepting of oddball tweaking than your typical DIY Audio denizen, though naturally some/much of it is true and pure snake oil.
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Old 25th April 2013, 09:26 PM   #19
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@Choco:
could be.

well, I guess it goes like this: A sees B as the enemy. A was once told by an engineering type that all an amp needs for good sound is 0.01% THD and flat FR. and that specific engineering type was wrong. therefore all engineering types are always wrong. it's even better to distance oneself from them. even hate them secretly. so A shuts down his mind. or reverses whatever B says. whatever B says, the opposite must be true.
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Last edited by mr_push_pull; 25th April 2013 at 09:29 PM.
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Old 25th April 2013, 09:28 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badman View Post
Which "end" a shield connects to can have a significant effect on the performance of said shield, I generally find best results when the shield is connected at source, but some people have found them better (for noise performance) connected the other way around, or terminated at one end with a capacitor, or, or, or.....
not the case here.

I agree with the rest of what you said. I personally find many if not all non audio-oriented EEs very close minded when it comes to audio. I don't even get into discussions with them because of that. one man can only take "I'll show you the schematic of the perfect amp" so many times.
IMO it's pretty obvious why there aren't many good audio engineers: they would have to be good EEs with an open mind and at the same time critical enough of voodoo. I don't believe these conditions are often met at the same time.
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Last edited by mr_push_pull; 25th April 2013 at 09:33 PM.
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