Psychic pair fail scientific test

[kevinahcc20]

In regards to Psychic testing,

This is what happens..you relax and look into the darkness in your mind<<this is the hard part because pictures are always popping in and out and its from yourself...with some long hard meditation, you can tell some pictures in your head look different (like a negative from an old camera) these pictures seem to glow a bit like night glow paint. And you can zoom in or out and get detail.

You say what you see and don't complete the whole picture..ie if you can see a scare or tattoo etc if someone then says they see the same thing and also tell you about the tattoo then this can be taken as evidence that what you see is not from you. (This is development not a science lesson)

It takes years of hard work and can make you ill if you are weak minded<<<why you ask because when you see the pictures your muscles distort giving the feeling of arthritis or other problems..HAHA yes its not funny..You need to have healers around you to protect you and people that are very stable..and they don't take fools gladly.

You can try and get something for months ...if "They don't want to talk you don't get anything"..I am told HAHA that if they think you can't handle it they won't contact you..if you are weak then you can be attacked by etc etc...
The idea seems to be if you see them, they see you..I don't have a clue if this is correct..However I woulden't take the chance..



Regards
M. Gregg

Perfect example...when your eyes are closed your visual system still has inputs from pressure changes timed to heartbeat or external pressure on the eyeball (press your eyelid with a finger & enjoy the fireworks) and from noise in the system. Your pattern recognizer will strain to reconstruct these visual inputs into a scene of some sort. This process can be enhanced significantly with the aid of LSD, which will allow you to construct such scenes even with your eyes open...it seems to interfere with the complex filtering system that turns a light pattern sweeping across the retina into a stable visual scene.

 

[M Gregg]

You missed the point.

Someone else sees what you see and can describe pictures in your mind that you can see even when you say nothing. LSD dosent do that even though I have never taken anything so would think its improbable..
Your heart beat changes your body tries to take on the shape of what ever "it" is, dogs can see it and respond. However its just all make believe isn't it..
I should add the pictures are in a sort of dream and not in your eyes..
This isn't about if you believe or not just why its hard to replicate on demand..I couldn't do it and would not even try...

I will add I did it because I want to have some idea if it was all make believe and hogwash...from a science point of view..
I got way more questions than answers..and I don't know what to think even now because there is something..however its way over my head..so I leave it alone.
Someone has to keep their eyes open at all times in the circle..and there are no weird things in the circle....(if you know what I mean)

Regards
M. Gregg

 

[M Gregg]

I only dipped my toe in the water,

I sat (every week) with the group for four years..most of the others were in their mid to late 60's with twenty years + experience. One with less time than me. So its not like picking up a mobile phone..

Regards
M. Gregg

 

[Wavebourn]

I think that's being a bit unfair to most people who "can pick things up", the trouble is that once you have to perform on demand, as a "do it now!" service, for monetary return, etc, then it brings an element of tension into the situation which runs counter to the state of mind that is necessary. A bit like, "You are going to hear someone tell a joke in 30 secs, and you are required to find it funny, and must laugh naturally upon hearing it!".

Which is why virtually every attempt to "scientifically" test this phenomenon is doomed to fail; you might as well say love on sight can't exist: "Scientists organised tens of thousands of single people to meet for a precisely specified period of time, in a random manner; and not a single marriage was the result - no evidence for love on sight was found ... "

Well said, about an element of tension. When I somehow "know" the answer that I physically can't know each time I have some kind of "Don't care" attitude. Like, when I "got" number of horses that will come first, one by one, thinking, "I don't want to play, but if I play I would choose this numbers...".
I put 3 numbers only on the list "which numbers will come first", and won exact sum I paid an hour before on a flea market when bought a pair of speakers for my car. But if I put all 4, I would get about 8 times more, because horses come one by one, exactly in the sequence the numbers appeared in my mind.
There were more cases of such "knowledge", and each time "don't care" attitude, i.e. total absence of any tension, or desire, presented. All it happened before I became Rosicrucian student and started mastering such abilities according to the ancient school. And learned that meditation is the main exercise, to master this "don't care" state of mind, when ego does not participate (well, in some degree).

 

[Cassiel]

Extrasensory perception is pretty common among great writers. I mean, how do you explain a character like Shakespeare in a rational way?

People love to talk about these things but to tell you the truth I don't know what they're talking about because there's not much to talk about in the first place. These things are out of the ordinary. Let's stick to food and women. Well, now that I think some people idealize women (mystics?) so let's stick to food. Now, that was a wonderful pizza. Out of this world variety.... I was in heaven.

 

[Wavebourn]

Pardon' can't edit: I would win 80 times more, probably the sum that I paid for the whole used car, not just for speakers for it. It was very non-ordinary coincidence that begged for attention. I could not ignore it, even though I was (and still am) skeptic.

 

[aardvarkash10]

so what about the times when you lost but didn't care?

 

[fas42]

Pardon' can't edit: I would win 80 times more, probably the sum that I paid for the whole used car, not just for speakers for it. It was very non-ordinary coincidence that begged for attention. I could not ignore it, even though I was (and still am) skeptic.

Good input, it's essential to always retain the questioning stance of the sceptic; once there's the smell of money in something then the rabble start to climb on board ...

And, the importance of "playfulness" -- if you start becoming deadly serious about it, then it starts to go "dead" ...

Frank

 

[Wavebourn]

so what about the times when you lost but didn't care?

How would I know that I lost if I did not care? Indeed, it is tough question.

It was the first and last time when I decided to play. And the coincidence was such as it can't be ignored. Got 4 numbers, _one_by_one_ of first horses that come first one by one. If I put that 4 numbers in the right order the price that I paid for the car could be returned. But I switching on my ego was a bit afraid to loose, and put 3 numbers only, for a chance that they will come first in any order, and returned the exact price for the speakers.
Then, after I started learning to master such skills, I learned that this "Don't care" attitude works indeed, as was taught by Mystic Masters of the antiquity. That's why when demonstrations that involve ego are conducted they fail. They contradict the main requirement: to switch off desires of Ego, in order to work. I can't tell you more, sorry, because the oath I gave to the Order is similar requirement, in order to learn and master such skills.

 

[fas42]

This reminds me ... when the US finally lost the America's Cup to us, in the 80's (makes rude gesture with hand on face ...) I knew, halfway through the final race that we were going to win: each yacht race is composed of a number of legs, I think they're called, and a pattern emerged: the yacht that won a particular leg was also the one that had won the corresponding, earlier race. The completion of the pattern meant that our boy, Alan Bond, had to win the final leg and therefore the race, and the series. This came to me in a flash early in the piece, and so in fact it played out ... (queue spooky music ...)

Frank

 

[fas42]

I can't tell you more, sorry, because the oath I gave to the Order is similar requirement, in order to learn and master such skills.

Or ... you could, but then we would all suffer from Spontaneous Human Combustion ...

Frank

 

[Wavebourn]

This reminds me ... when the US finally lost the America's Cup to us, in the 80's (makes rude gesture with hand on face ...) I knew, halfway through the final race that we were going to win: each yacht race is composed of a number of legs, I think they're called, and a pattern emerged: the yacht that won a particular leg was also the one that had won the corresponding, earlier race. The completion of the pattern meant that our boy, Alan Bond, had to win the final leg and therefore the race, and the series. This came to me in a flash early in the piece, and so in fact it played out ... (queue spooky music ...)

Such things can be mastered. Once Sregey Zadvorny (bass-baritone singer, now RIP) told the story. He listened to the opera in which John Minagro was singing one of the roles. Sergey said, during his area he imagined a nice meadow with flowers around, and after the performance he shared his visions with John. John said, "So what? I imagined this exactly when singing". It was not a surprise to John, because he used to be then well trained Rosicrucian student, and he knew that his skills to concentrate caused radiation of his thought, even when he did not do that intentionally. It is the main difference, between "believe or not", and "master this skills, or not". In order to master this skills it is not needed to believe. Just do, and calibrate according to the end result.

 

[Wavebourn]

Or ... you could, but then we would all suffer from Spontaneous Human Combustion ...

No. I feel I would loose the further ability to learn, and betray that great people who passed this knowledge through the ages. It is what happened to the author of "The Wisdom of Mystic Masters", Joseph J. Weed, who wrote his book in order to simplify people the learning process. Exercises in his book work. And I was scared when tried one of them, because I was not prepared to get the result and to face it. This case closed for me some abilities for several years.

 

[fas42]

No. I feel I would loose the further ability to learn, and betray that great people who passed this knowledge through the ages. It is what happened to the author of "The Wisdom of Mystic Masters", Joseph J. Weed, who wrote his book in order to simplify people the learning process. Exercises in his book work. And I was scared when tried one of them, because I was not prepared to get the result and to face it. This case closed for me some abilities for several years.

Of course I was just injecting some Aussie humour into the situation, I fully understand where you're coming from ... .

The interesting thing, that which can really convince someone who approaches the subject of the paranormal with an open mind, is the commonality of experiences in cultures and groups of people who were historically completely disconnected. In other words, don't listen to precisely what a particular set of beliefs say, but read between the lines, what are the core experiences that have caused a set of rituals, or attitudes or behaviours to come into being: if one does so in a reasonably intellectually honest fashion then the weight of "evidence" is quite immense ...

Frank

 

[counter culture]

In fact, if I went the whole hog, and indeed decide to believe that that the moon landing was faked, how would you prove it to me? Every time you offered up documents, and bits of objects, and interviews with people I would exclaim that the US has tremendous financial resources, it has a lot to lose if it's found guilty of fraud, so it will do whatever it takes to make sure that the tracks of its deception are always covered.

So how could you finally convince that the moon landing was real ...?

Er, by pointing out that the USSR was in a position to debunk any fraud at the time? If anybody had a vested interest in discrediting the US, and the resources to do it, it was the USSR.

I mean, it was called the Space Race.

When the Russians put Sputnik into orbit they made it impossible to controvert by putting a transmitter in it that any radio ham could receive.

So what argument are you going to advance to convince me that the USSR was a party to the moon landing fraud?

 

[Wavebourn]

Sure, and the point is, when you try to do controlled experiments you inevitably switch on emotions that disrupt the result. It reminds me quantum observers' paradox, though it may be not the same, just looks quite similarly.

But controlled experiments had been done, they involved true random number generators and statistics analysis. And they demonstrate results that can't be explained using accepted scientific models.

 

[SY]

That just shows you how good the conspiracy was!

 

[Wavebourn]

Er, by pointing out that the USSR was in a position to debunk any fraud at the time? If anybody had a vested interest in discrediting the US, and the resources to do it, it was the USSR.

I mean, it was called the Space Race.

When the Russians put Sputnik into orbit they made it impossible to controvert by putting a transmitter in it that any radio ham could receive.

So what argument are you going to advance to convince me that the USSR was a party to the moon landing fraud?

Good point, proof "from the opposite".

 

[Wavebourn]

That just shows you how good the conspiracy was!

Now you call for the force above both East and West.

Name it Stuart!

 

[M Gregg]

Its interesting,


The power of the (mind?)...I spent some time (20 years) with various martial arts teachers (not to become a fighter just interest) some quite scarey..it was this that led me to the questions I could not answer.


KI, CHI, Prana..life force..


Some of it was quite clever...some of it very hard to answer..some of it frightening..one teacher said to me whats the difference between a dog on a lead and a dog attacking you in the wild...(its all in the mind) then knocked me out as I blinked..


Demonstrations of KI and things similar to power of the jedi mind tricks..they called it leading the mind..so I studied KI again to see if it was hogwash..
Because of a few problems injury I met healers....the rest is history.

Then I met a woman who was a "medium" she said," why are you talking to me you already know what I'm going to say". She said I'm just going to open a chakra..I thought yeh right..she looked at me and closed her eyes..suddenly my heart changed rhythm and I got a bit panicky..she said its alright its your heart I know, it will go in a minute..it always happens...I will show you the difference in feeling..this is from you..she read my thoughts...then this is from spirit and the feeling changed..now you know she said if its real or fake..
How can reading you mind be fake? if it happened...she ment that if you get a message and its not a real one..

Of course this is all about cold reading isn't it..

Regards
M. Gregg