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Old 11th November 2012, 01:14 PM   #211
Cassiel is offline Cassiel  Libya
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Rationality is overrated. It is indeed a burden for some people. No matter what people think or don't think the natural order is always established.
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Old 11th November 2012, 03:45 PM   #212
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
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OK it would be interesting,

What are your thoughts on this. Fictitious example..

Lets use the Dragon in my garage as an example..I think about a dragon..when does the thought exist..there is no proof that I ever thought about a dragon..I can see it in my head..where does the picture of the dragon exist?

Next you create a picture of the dragon...I describe the dragon is green correct..it has no tail correct, it can talk..correct..its is now changing colour to blue..this is also correct...<<this would be stupid..

Then both of us wait for something to appear in our head we see a dragon, however neither of us know we see a dragon..I say I see a dragon..OK you can see one as well..the dragon is blue..this is correct..then You say it has no tail this is correct..it can talk correct..it is holding a sign...I say it says look at me...you say this is correct..

This must be cold reading..correct? If not what is it?

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Old 11th November 2012, 07:55 PM   #213
fas42 is online now fas42  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Gregg View Post
Lets use the Dragon in my garage as an example..I think about a dragon..when does the thought exist..there is no proof that I ever thought about a dragon..I can see it in my head..where does the picture of the dragon exist?

Next you create a picture of the dragon...I describe the dragon is green correct..it has no tail correct, it can talk..correct..its is now changing colour to blue..this is also correct...<<this would be stupid..
One can go a step further. Let's say no such dragons exist, at the moment. But, for whatever reasons, a considerable number of people believe that it would make for a more interesting world if such "pets" did exist -- then slowly but surely such beasties would begin to manifest ...

This is all part of that awkward theory, by some, that the physical is a projection of, results from the existence of consciousness, rather than the conventional, other way round theory ...

Frank
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Old 11th November 2012, 08:06 PM   #214
fas42 is online now fas42  Australia
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yes... it's true... we haven't (discovered, analyzed, explained, comprehended,... fill in your favorite verb[iage] here) everything

kind of goes without saying, don't you think??
Yes, it's kind of easy, emotionally, to do this in one direction, looking down on the smaller; or the less intelligent, "things", no matter how large they are -- just a bit harder considering going in the other direction.

I'm reminded here of the classic cartoon image used with the musical "My Fair Lady": the professor using his puppeteer's strings to manipulate his charming "subject"; meanwhile, above in the clouds ...

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Old 12th November 2012, 01:34 PM   #215
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
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Is this,

The picture you were thinking about?

Just curious....the only question would be is there another set of strings?

Just a thought...would it fair (pun) to say that our thoughts animate our body..however when my body moved in circle..my thoughts were my own..however the feelings were mixed with "closeness"...its hard to remember exactly..


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Old 12th November 2012, 01:56 PM   #216
SY is offline SY  United States
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It's strings all the way down.
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Old 12th November 2012, 02:01 PM   #217
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
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It's strings all the way down.
Turtles... ...oups yes strings....quark "pardon".

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Old 12th November 2012, 02:13 PM   #218
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
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In meditation (burmese),

I have had jerking of the limbs..the guy running it said it was Vipassana..I just thought it was loss of control of the muscles..just sudden jurking...however this was not the same feeling......like the sudden feeling of euphoria that I got after about 18 months of sitting..it felt like when you see a sudden beautiful landscape..however all there was..was a grey fog and suddenly being aware that you were not awake...however you were sitting upright in meditation...I tried to make it happen again with no luck..

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M. Gregg
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Old 12th November 2012, 02:18 PM   #219
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maybe these kinds of studies have some relevance, eh?

http://arxiv.org/ftp/physics/papers/0312/0312115.pdf
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Old 12th November 2012, 02:34 PM   #220
M Gregg is offline M Gregg  United Kingdom
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Its interesting,

Dr Quantum - Double Slit Experiment - YouTube

I guess we probably have the answer to this now...If anyone knows?
If this was the case how do the people at CERN know that they are not effecting the outcome?


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M. Gregg
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