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Old 13th January 2013, 06:17 PM   #8061
dvv is online now dvv  Serbia
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Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
Correction , 1ohm from 300-22K ..
No, it goes that much upwards ???

So what does it do below 22 kHz, drops down to 0.5 Ohms?

Were your speakers made by a company called "Arc Welding Acoustics", or some such?
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Old 13th January 2013, 06:19 PM   #8062
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Loudness comp usually switches out after a certain db, a 12db bass boost better be accompanied by a lot of power to avoid clipping.
The thing is, Wayne, that these days, it's DAMN hard to find a new volume pot with a center tap. They seem to have gone off the radar altogether.

And if you should run into any, these would usually be of very questionable quality, from a source you never even heard of.
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Old 13th January 2013, 07:06 PM   #8063
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Frankly i have never had the need for a loudness comp , low or high the perspective is always the same, if you need to use loudness comp then this suggest to me the speaker has poor balance and quite possibly poor micro dynamics ...
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Old 13th January 2013, 07:12 PM   #8064
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Frankly i have never had the need for a loudness comp , low or high the perspective is always the same, if you need to use loudness comp then this suggest to me the speaker has poor balance and quite possibly poor micro dynamics ...
Do I understand you correctly?

You are saying it's all the same, low or high volume, so long as the speaker is linear?

Which implies that the Fletcher-Munson curves are a result of very bad ganja?

That your own hearing rises above mere mortal status?
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Old 13th January 2013, 07:42 PM   #8065
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Look at the FM curve its the same low or high db , so if your speaker sounds thin low , it will sound thin high if not the speaker has poor balance and grows unevenly ...
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Old 13th January 2013, 08:23 PM   #8066
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Originally Posted by dvv View Post
Do I understand you correctly?

You are saying it's all the same, low or high volume, so long as the speaker is linear?

Which implies that the Fletcher-Munson curves are a result of very bad ganja?

That your own hearing rises above mere mortal status?
I'm on a.wayne's side -- a system working correctly will sound correct in frequency balance, irrespective of volume, because the brain "knows" what's going on. If it's louder than you're acoustically closer to the sound makers, softer means significantly further away -- just like in real life, with real instruments ...

These are the cues a system gives when it sounds like the "real thing", in other words ...

Frank
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Old 14th January 2013, 06:21 AM   #8067
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There were "scientific" explanations for loudness controls initially found in German radios, as if it had something to do with F-M curves. Nonsense! Germans such a way extended frequency range of speakers using excess power when volume turned down, adding 12 dB / oct boost below Fs, that's why 2 taps, and even more complex schemes were used.
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Old 14th January 2013, 06:25 AM   #8068
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The thing is, Wayne, that these days, it's DAMN hard to find a new volume pot with a center tap. They seem to have gone off the radar altogether.
You don't need a tapped pot, just add a switch that attenuates signal and engages EQ according to your speaker, so you can switch on lower volume and get one more octave below.
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Old 14th January 2013, 07:03 AM   #8069
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Gentlemen, thank you for your musings, but I'd like a straight yes or no answer.

Do you think Fletcher-Munson curves more or less precisely describe our hearing at lower and higher levels?

Talking about speaker linearity is truly evading the point, as its linearity is assumed. If it changes its tonal balance with changes of volume, then it hasn't been properly designed, something is amiss.

FYI my speakers do not change their tonal balance with change of volume, the louder it goes, the more of the same you get. Given the minscule dimensions of my room, they usually work at low levels.
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Old 14th January 2013, 07:07 AM   #8070
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You don't need a tapped pot, just add a switch that attenuates signal and engages EQ according to your speaker, so you can switch on lower volume and get one more octave below.
You're right, I don't need a tapped pot, because I will adopt Yamaha's scheme of things, where effectively a separate pot does not boost lows and highs, but selectively attenuates the midrange to obtain a F-M curve.

The other, subjective reason is that this scheme is the best I've heard so far regarding its negative effects on the overall sound.
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