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Old 6th September 2012, 06:45 AM   #7101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
I cant believe that's a 1944 tape , how is that possible ...?
They did not have than beliefs and fashions that are accepted as "best engineering practice" today.
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Old 6th September 2012, 07:35 AM   #7102
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They did not have than beliefs and fashions that are accepted as "best engineering practice" today.
That, and the fact that at the time everything they knew about tape recording they learnt from Telefunken which invented tape recording, but Telefunken never told all they knew about it.

1944 was NOT a good year for exchanging information with Germany. Their information had a nice caliber attached to it.
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Old 6th September 2012, 10:00 AM   #7103
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They did not have than beliefs and fashions that are accepted as "best engineering practice" today.

In the early days of CD a man came into my shop who wanted to buy a Sansui SR222 turntable . I did what I never would today and stopped him from buying it . Perhaps it was out of stock . I asked as to what hi-fi he had . If I recall Quad and BMW 801's . I said for a modest upgrade in budget a Rega Planar 2 might be better . A Thorens TD160 ideal . It turns out the equipment was on loan from his work , the turntable he had to buy himself . He worked for EMI . Out of nowhere I said " how do you explain the worsening standards in recording " . He nearly jumped out of his skin . Patiently he asked me to define what I meant . I would say almost brushing away a tear he said to me to name recordings that supported that . His next comment was " I recorded that , I was technical director in 1959 " . The next bit confirmed my feelings and I quote him as I remember " . " When I went to EMI I had to pass the same test as a conductor of music . I had to sight read music and play four instruments . I was asked if I minded learning the technical side of splicing and machine maintenance . Gradually technicians took over who were asked if they liked music " . He went on to say liking music is not the same as understanding music . He also said how he could insist Maria Callas record something she disliked ( eg Macbeth ) . Now she would say no . His belief was that given the opportunity the music needed recording , making money was not considered of prime importance . The 1953 recording of Callas of Tosca is a masterpiece , original Vinyl especially . I heard it once via a Lyra Helikon Mono .
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Old 6th September 2012, 10:43 AM   #7104
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Callas !!!! Alas if only ( It is possible the man I met did recorded it for real . He promised never to release anything she felt unworthy . Maybe a 50 year rule on that ? ) .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alrB...feature=fvwrel

Last edited by nigel pearson; 6th September 2012 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 6th September 2012, 11:53 AM   #7105
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Like it or not, I think we need to realize that just as the appearence of mass pop music in the 60ies was a revolution in all senses of the word, it also made the music business more lucrative than ever. Suddenly, there were hundreds of millions to be made, because now, purchasing of LPs was no longer limited to a small band of affictionados.

Technology in general also promoted this, as music devices started being made in much larger numbers thus cutting costs of single units, and more affordable models started to appear (I will not discuss their general musical qualities, but more people DID buy them). All of which spawned the music industry, encompassing both software and hardware.

Suddenly, many groups became hot, as their singles and later LPs started to be sold by the million. In the 50ies, you got a golden LP for selling 100,000 LPs, in the 60ies this limit was raised to 1 million.

And recording standards started to first slide, and then drop appreciably. It had to be so, when the latest hit by so-and-so was recorded in a hotel room, on a portable low cost machine, when the artists were stoned out of their minds. Also, small, independent studio started mushrooming all around, and they had highly questionable technical and musical standards.

All of which had a negative effect on recording, mastering and LP stamping practices. Now it was no longer about quality, it was all about how fast can you get it out to the market.

Look at the pop charts of the late 60ies and early 70ies - note how many new groups appeared out of nowhere, had one huge hit, and then disappeared (e.g Zager & Evans, "In the year 2525"). SOMEBODY had to cater for all those wannabes, and it sure wasn't the big time music industry, given the costs of their studios per hour. That was a luxury you had stay on top for a time to earn.

If all this wasn't so, then where did the "super LP" companies come from? And who would they cater for, if not for the infinite minority of us who were not prepared to accept just any old ecoding so long as it was hot on the charts?

It is my contention that most of those "super LP" companies were simply people who believed in doing things RIGHT, who didn't cut corners to save up on costs. Of course, a few of them tried to advance the state of the art as well, people like Mobile, Decca, etc. In many ways, they succeeded, but the CD more or less put an end to that. The new gadget was here, and very few indeed though about how to get the maximum out of the new and promising technology, most saw it as a still better sales vehicle.

Quality audio was brought down by hit-and-run economics.
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Old 6th September 2012, 12:12 PM   #7106
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One must remember George Martin was classically trained . I have always thought especially Pink Floyd were created by their engineers understanding everything about music and recording .

If food it is like we all converted to junk food by preference now . Given a little thought perhaps it's a sign of the times and I am obsolete .
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Old 6th September 2012, 01:58 PM   #7107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel pearson View Post
In the early days of CD a man came into my shop
Nigel, do you remember the name of this man?

George
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Old 6th September 2012, 02:24 PM   #7108
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Originally Posted by gpapag View Post
Nigel, do you remember the name of this man?

George
I never had the courage to ask his name . So sad I had to validate him ( I had and I could tell ) . It must be a well known man . Anyone who tells Maria Callas what to do must be . His words as best as I rememeber " Maria I know you don't sing that , however your voice has never been better suited and may be at it's peak . Lets do it and you decided later . If you hate it , it will never be released . " .

I told him of how I disliked digital and said EMI digital to be better than most ( own recording device ) . He agreed . I said I preferred EMI vinyl of digital origin to EMI CD . I asked was it possible that the Vinyl was closer to the master-tape ? He looked very puzzled and said they would not deliberately cut Vinyl worse than they could . He accepted in going to 44.1 kHz it might suffer . He did say the master-tape was better than CD it I remember accurately ?

I met Germany's Ortofon man 1939-45 , never asked his name either . He shock my hand behind my back ( ? ) .
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Old 6th September 2012, 02:37 PM   #7109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel pearson View Post
In the early days of CD a man came into my shop who wanted to buy a Sansui SR222 turntable . I did what I never would today and stopped him from buying it . Perhaps it was out of stock . I asked as to what hi-fi he had . If I recall Quad and BMW 801's . I said for a modest upgrade in budget a Rega Planar 2 might be better . A Thorens TD160 ideal .
Curiously I'd planned that the Sansui SR222 Mk2 would be my first 'serious' TT. I'd dreamed of having a Rega 2 but from reading the hifi press at the time, they were hard to get hold of - this was 1979, a few years before CD. In the end I was surprised that the shop (Radlett Audio) offered to sell me one as they didn't stock Sansui. I jumped at the chance, even though the price was close to double that of the Sansui. I went for an Ortofon VMS20e cartridge, my amp was NAD3020 and the speakers Celef Domestic II. That system served me very well through my student years and beyond
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Old 6th September 2012, 03:17 PM   #7110
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I had every turntable I could sell . I loved them and still do . I seriously plan to have that shop again . If the stock could be loaned I would do it tomorrow ( or would I ) .

Someone told me I am the world expert on this . I am not . Many of my friends know far more . I probably know more about amplifiers and that's not much . I know how to make a turntable perhaps ?

Linn were a bit unhappy with me . I sold loads , however I wouldn't become a zealot . I sold loads of TD160 also . My best ever seller in early days was Trio KD1033 . It was very good and cheap . Still prefer it to most CD players .

Would have liked to have sold Platine Verdier .
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