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Old 25th July 2012, 09:33 AM   #6911
tsiros is offline tsiros  Greece
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you seem confused and underinformed
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Old 25th July 2012, 09:37 AM   #6912
SY is offline SY  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsiros View Post
you seem confused and underinformed
Perhaps a technical, rather than personal, criticism might be more appropriate.
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Old 25th July 2012, 09:43 AM   #6913
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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Yes, it might be more helpful to say that WMA and MP3 are not the same although both belong to the family of lossy compression, achieved by throwing away information.
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Old 25th July 2012, 10:23 AM   #6914
tsiros is offline tsiros  Greece
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I want to publicly apologise to dvv for my previous comment. It was, at best, uncalled for. At worst, insulting.

flac is the same, aurally, as redbook CD. About mp3: joint stereo along with some other parameters sacrifice channel separation for filesize. I have no idea if wma supports these parameters. wma is a different beast to mp3 and it is a slightly worse version of mp3. Mainly because you can not tweak it. (set aside that mp3 has a buttload of faults which i am bored to list here)

I still maintain that you will not be able to tell the difference between uncompressed and a 320kbit mp3 with high quality encoder (not "mp3pro") and no "joint stereo"or others.

Last edited by tsiros; 25th July 2012 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 25th July 2012, 10:32 AM   #6915
gk7 is offline gk7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvv View Post
I don't know what "joint stereo" is.
Only the channel differences are stored to reconstruct stereo. (as opposed to
two independent channels for left and right.)

Joint (audio engineering) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 25th July 2012, 10:56 AM   #6916
dvv is offline dvv  Serbia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gk7 View Post
Only the channel differences are stored to reconstruct stereo. (as opposed to
two independent channels for left and right.)

Joint (audio engineering) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Thank you, GK7.

As I said several times over, I am completely lost in this world of lossy compression in general, I know only the very bare of facts, which is not enough to find my way.

I never needed to know anything about it, because I never needed nor wanted to use it. And probably never would, if my car didn't dictate one of those formats. To me, throwing away parts of the signal is sacriledge, it's something one deserves to be, well not burnt at the stake, but at least expelled from the audio community as a vandal and a hooligan. And I don't give a damn if 90% of the kids today are getting high on that sound.

All my life, I was hell bent on getting as much as could from the signal into the loudspeakers or headphones, appearently the opposite what MP3 is about. As I understand it, it is effectivvely a 4-bit format after compression, but it does cut the file size, in my case, by a factor of 5:1.

The manual says the device will recognize files with extenstions .m3u and .pls. It also says WMA files will be rocgnized only if mase with Windows Media Player 8.0 or higher - I use Windows 7 64-bit professional, I tried this and it works perfectly.

Because of the 5:1 compression ratio, I assumed WMA was some version or subvariant of MP3, so I am hardly surprised to learn from one of messages above that it's an inferior version - I'm used to Windows having the junk built inside, which needs to be replaced.

N.B.: My previously posted comments on bloated bass and lacking treble refer to standard 16-bit WAV files converted to WMA by Windows itself. Thus, they should not surprise anyone.

Fortunately, my Nero program has its own MP3 converter, and it has a LOT of choices, including a compression ratio selector. I gather from all your comments that I should get to know it better and preferably forget the WMA format as made by Windows.

Any suggestions on better quality MP3 conversion from CDs as the signal source would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 25th July 2012, 11:05 AM   #6917
dvv is offline dvv  Serbia
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@tsiros

No offence taken, hence no apology necessary. I'm still going for my summer vacation to Afitos, Kassandra, 110 km from Thessaloniki, 16th year running. I remain undaunted.:-)))))

Besides, realistically speaking, you are quite right, perhaps not so confused, but very definitely most underinformed. Never needed it, was never interested in it. I spent my time doing whatever I could to make a CD copy as similar to the original as I knew how to make it.

FLAC was demonstrated to me by a friend who's very interested in it, but it was not a real auditioning session, so I honestly cannot comment on it. It will take at least some hours of comparing for me to have any general opinion of it. At this time, all I can say is that the idea is intrguing.
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Old 25th July 2012, 11:08 AM   #6918
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Given the fact that harddisks are getting bigger and cheaper every month I think lossy compression is a thing of the past. (My iPod, which I use in my car has 160G and almost anything on itīs disk is stored lossless).

If you need to use MP3 the lame encoder ( LAME MP3 Encoder :: Related Links ) is regarded
by many as the best, you might want to use it with EAC ( ripping CDs). Both programs are free.

Lame comes with some presets, the highest quality setting (at the cost of bigger files) is called "insane", so lame --preset insane some_file.wav some_file.mp3 would be the command
line.

Presets and settings are explained here:
LAME - Hydrogenaudio Knowledgebase
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Old 25th July 2012, 11:26 AM   #6919
dvv is offline dvv  Serbia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gk7 View Post
Given the fact that harddisks are getting bigger and cheaper every month I think lossy compression is a thing of the past. (My iPod, which I use in my car has 160G and almost anything on itīs disk is stored lossless).

If you need to use MP3 the lame encoder ( LAME MP3 Encoder :: Related Links ) is regarded
by many as the best, you might want to use it with EAC ( ripping CDs). Both programs are free.

Lame comes with some presets, the highest quality setting (at the cost of bigger files) is called "insane", so lame --preset insane some_file.wav some_file.mp3 would be the command
line.

Presets and settings are explained here:
LAME - Hydrogenaudio Knowledgebase
Sehr dank, GK7, just what the doctor ordered! Schnaps is on me the next time I'm in Vienna.
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Old 25th July 2012, 11:36 AM   #6920
tsiros is offline tsiros  Greece
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dvv, the best quality lossy encoding will be 320kbit/s, current - best quality- codec, 22050 maximum bandwidth, no "mid-side Joint Stereo", no "intensity JS" and no "narrrowing of stereo image".

the mp3 encoder licensed from fraunhoffer institut (they created mp3) allows these options. I have not much experience with LAME the past years because ever since i got hold of the original manufacturer encode, i think lame can only be worse. It still allows configuration though so YMMV.
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