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Old 4th March 2012, 01:20 AM   #691
SY is offline SY  United States
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Originally Posted by serengetiplains View Post
What is non-locality if not something non-physical, or in other words something constitutive of what we call material.
It's not physical, it's a mathematical construct. The construct successfully predicts the outcome of measurements.
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Old 4th March 2012, 01:30 AM   #692
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I know. It's a mathematic construct that exists in potential space until it actualizes (collapses, etc). I'm asking why that construct gives prediction? What is the link between construct and result? I'm saying you will never find that link, because "linking" is of the order of actual, not potential, potentiality being fundamentally indistinctly "everywhere". That everywhereness is beyond physical.

I'm further saying quantum physics is seeing the necessity of that polarity between actual and potential and using both in the theory itself. Non-locality is baseline implied by quantum physics, and is showing up as viable in labs, as expected. Quantum physics is therefore already-metaphysical, and physical---both.
 
Old 4th March 2012, 02:05 AM   #693
SY is offline SY  United States
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Originally Posted by serengetiplains View Post
I know. It's a mathematic construct that exists in potential space until it actualizes (collapses, etc).
No, mathematical constructs are roadmaps, not roads.
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Old 4th March 2012, 02:37 AM   #694
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Originally Posted by Wavebourn View Post
So, a new theory puts Inertia Constant instead of "C" in the center of the Universe?
Not new...absent the question of the life expectancy of a particle (proton for instance) I believe the accepted rest inertial mass as a fixed value is settled.
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Old 4th March 2012, 02:55 AM   #695
Bonsai is offline Bonsai  Taiwan
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By the way, very interesting article in the February Scientific American on the Quantum Universe. Foam like structures rule space time at the tiniest levels apparently.
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Old 4th March 2012, 07:09 AM   #696
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Maybe I utilize different definitions...
Science - study of the nature of existents.
Metaphysics - study of the nature of existence.
BIG difference.
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Old 4th March 2012, 11:59 AM   #697
tvrgeek is offline tvrgeek  United States
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Originally Posted by Bonsai View Post
By the way, very interesting article in the February Scientific American on the Quantum Universe. Foam like structures rule space time at the tiniest levels apparently.
They have been talking foam for years. One of many ideas. Has SA changed from "two paragraphs of really good stuff followed by four pages of trying to impress their friends" format? That's why I dropped it years ago. I get the first paragraph from most of the significant publications in a news feed at work (Science, Nature etc) , so I have never gone back.
 
Old 5th March 2012, 06:29 PM   #698
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What, then, is at "absolute rest"? The phrase must have meaning, yes?
If you could measure a velocity relative to a point in space, that would be an absolute velocity based on Newtonian mechanics. This is considered impossible based on Newtonian mechanics. Since aether and space are two different things, then a velocity relative to the aether is NOT an absolute velocity, at least in the pre-Einsteinian aether theories, such as the Lorentz aether theory. Einstein fanatics were brainwashed into believing the unproven assumption that the aether would be at absolute rest if it existed. The air and oceans have their own frame of reference relative to observers on earth. Are they at absolute rest?
 
Old 5th March 2012, 09:20 PM   #699
GloBug is offline GloBug  Canada
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Sure you can view the ocean at "rest" from the standpoint of any single particle.

So you have many many points of reference, all of which are at rest relative to the others around it.

So the ocean is completely at rest, all the time, depending how you want to look at it.

Last edited by GloBug; 5th March 2012 at 09:24 PM.
 
Old 5th March 2012, 10:20 PM   #700
tvrgeek is offline tvrgeek  United States
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A particle can only be at rest at absolute zero. So the argument is that if you are sitting on one particle and do not sense inertia as your speed is constant, then it is everything else looks to be in motion.

Kind of reminds me of a friend who owned a stereo store back in Boulder. A kid came in and asks what a cartridge cost. "$29.95" was the reply (very fair). The kid asked if he had a better price. "$39.95" "It is all a matter of perspective!"
 

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