John Curl's Blowtorch preamplifier part II - Page 543 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Member Areas > The Lounge

The Lounge A place to talk about almost anything but politics and religion.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 4th August 2010, 07:50 AM   #5421
diyAudio Member
 
jan.didden's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Great City of Turnhout, Belgium
Blog Entries: 7
Much less off-topic than the previous post:

Audio cable break in, analog vs. digital nonsense

enjoy!

jd
__________________
If you don't change your beliefs, your life will be like this forever. Is that good news? - W S Maugham
Check out Linear Audio!
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 07:57 AM   #5422
diyAudio Member
 
jan.didden's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Great City of Turnhout, Belgium
Blog Entries: 7
This is a new one as far as I know:

/quote:
"Would anyone be interested in my DVD- and Blu-Ray rewinder? The bit domains in a disc eventually become skewed by being spun in only one direction during playback, which increases the amount of error correction alarmingly. My rewinder spins the disc backwards, but only after applying a gradual, and acceleration-limited ramp up to approximately 60,000 rpm. After only 12 days, your disc is completely re-aligned and ready to be played once more."

jd
__________________
If you don't change your beliefs, your life will be like this forever. Is that good news? - W S Maugham
Check out Linear Audio!
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 08:16 AM   #5423
Werner is offline Werner  Europe
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Belgium
Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
Please read the Lipshitz papers and have a look at the (randomly chosen) experimental data presented by Stereophile.
There is no need for that. Papers on dither won't convince those that either lack the mathematical insight required (no offence) or just don't want to be convinced.

Last year I wrote an article for TNT that demonstrates flat dither and noise shaping. It includes sound clips of a hypothetical 4-bit system.

Listening beats reading.

That Dither Thing - [English]

A well-known audio designer I hold in high esteem, despite his own mistrust of dither, listened to the clips and remarked that the music was too sparse and 'safe' to be of value here. I then made him the same sort of demo, now with solo drums and cymbals. After this he shut up.


--

As an aside to Joachim: the Korg Audiogate resampling software is not
exactly the best available, see src.infinitewave.ca
__________________
bring back dynamic range

Last edited by Werner; 4th August 2010 at 08:23 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 09:35 AM   #5424
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
Perhaps I could be 'mistaken'?
No, not after the third or fourth time you've trotted out that notion and had it refuted.

Quote:
Papers on dither won't convince those that either lack the mathematical insight required (no offence) or just don't want to be convinced.
I think you've hit that one dead center. The result is counterintuitive, and unless one understands the math and understands the results of the quotidian confirmation of theory, the reaction is likely to be, "But it CAN'T work!" The other portion, of course, is a seemingly emotional need to cling to old modes of thought and resist progress. Thanks for the interesting link- there's also a link in there to the excellent and educational paper by Hicks.
__________________
You might be screaming "No, no, no" and all they hear is "Who wants cake?" Let me tell you something: They all do. They all want cake.- Wilford Brimley
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 12:40 PM   #5425
diyAudio Member
 
john curl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: berkeley ca
I still could be 'mistaken' because I don't know anything different.
I have interacted in print and in person for more than 30 years with Dr. Lipshitz and his colleagues, and I have some idea of their position. In fact, to show my position let me quote something that I wrote to rebut Doug Self, almost 25 years ago. This was never sent into the magazine, either WW or HFN, but it still reads well today.
"... I realize that some 'authorities' in the audio profession will never accept that any capacitor differences are sonically important, but remember that these same individuals hear little if any differences between whole preamps and power amps. Also, these same individuals have ignored any criticisms of the limitations of their version of double blind testing, even from fellow academics who, as well, are university professors. In any case, I can do little about that, or their persistent opinion that improvement over traditional circuitry is unnecessary. I personally choose to ignore unproductive criticism, and will endeavour to develop the best designs possible with present technology."
This was written about 1987. Has anything changed much? My position, theirs? If so, please give me a direct answer to what they are about, and how I am 'mistaken'.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 01:50 PM   #5426
SY is offline SY  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
SY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Chicagoland
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
I have interacted in print and in person for more than 30 years with Dr. Lipshitz and his colleagues, and I have some idea of their position.
So when you misrepresent their research conclusions, it's intentional?

I'm still not sure how this transitioned from jj to Doug Self (who doesn't research MP3) to Stanley Lipshitz (I don't know if he's researched MP3) in just a few sentences, but I'm not breathing the Berkeley air.
__________________
You might be screaming "No, no, no" and all they hear is "Who wants cake?" Let me tell you something: They all do. They all want cake.- Wilford Brimley
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 02:03 PM   #5427
diyAudio Member
 
Johnloudb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Interesting experiment Werner. I didn't dare listen to the tracks though, the measurements told all I needed.

Well, I never new there was any controversy over dither or noise shaping or heard any arguments that it didn't work. But, I wouldn't be surprised if there was. I assumed that using dither is now standard fare in recording studios?

I find that HDCD encoded discs sound surprisingly good on my OPPO BPD83 Nuforce Edition, but not many out there. The music industry has dropped the ball when it comes to high end unfortunately. MP3 is king now, and that's life. It seems the LP has beat out the SACD in the high end format wars.
__________________
My Website: Hyperacusis, Tinnitus, My Story

Last edited by Johnloudb; 4th August 2010 at 02:05 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 02:35 PM   #5428
diyAudio Member
 
auplater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: KyOhWVa tristate
Default could this be inciteful (sic) or what??

Quote:
Originally Posted by janneman View Post
This is a new one as far as I know:

/quote:
"Would anyone be interested in my DVD- and Blu-Ray rewinder? The bit domains in a disc eventually become skewed by being spun in only one direction during playback, which increases the amount of error correction alarmingly. My rewinder spins the disc backwards, but only after applying a gradual, and acceleration-limited ramp up to approximately 60,000 rpm. After only 12 days, your disc is completely re-aligned and ready to be played once more."

jd
I do believe you've stumbled on to what's wrong with NASCAR...

... too many "left-turns only"...

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
"...His brain is squirming like a toad..." Jim Morrison
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 03:16 PM   #5429
diyAudio Member
 
scott wurcer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: cambridge ma
Quote:
Originally Posted by janneman View Post
This is a new one as far as I know:

/quote:
My rewinder spins the disc backwards, but only after applying a gradual, and acceleration-limited ramp up to approximately 60,000 rpm. After only 12 days, your disc is completely re-aligned and ready to be played once more."

jd
" with small cracks rapidly growing into catastrophic breakages when centripetally stressed at 10,000 - 13,000rpm (i.e. 40-52 CAV). "

No actually the disk is turned into schrapnel in seconds.
__________________
"Greetings from The Humungus! The Lord Humungus! The Warrior of the Wasteland! The Ayatollah of Rock and Rolla!" aka the Wizard of Wrestling.
  Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2010, 03:25 PM   #5430
diyAudio Member
 
jan.didden's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Great City of Turnhout, Belgium
Blog Entries: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
" with small cracks rapidly growing into catastrophic breakages when centripetally stressed at 10,000 - 13,000rpm (i.e. 40-52 CAV). "

No actually the disk is turned into schrapnel in seconds.
Yes. We used to spin cryogenically (sp?) treated F100 jet engine compressor sections at 100.000 rpm for stress testing. If a blade broke off, it usually also was the end of the spinning installation.

The piece I quoted was actually a tongue-in-cheek from an audio sceptic.
I wonder how many pre-orders he got

jd
__________________
If you don't change your beliefs, your life will be like this forever. Is that good news? - W S Maugham
Check out Linear Audio!
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:58 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2