John Curl's Blowtorch preamplifier part II - Page 511 - diyAudio
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Old 23rd July 2010, 01:37 PM   #5101
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Originally Posted by janneman View Post
Joshua,

While I understand the wish to select your projects on some kind of trustworthy listening result, your statement above cannot be easily resolved.
You agree that anecdotal listening reports from individual listeners don't say anything about what you would like or not, yet you don't want to select your amp unless there is a listening report.
Indeed, it cannot be easily solved.
Indeed, I cannot rely blindly on any listening reports.
However, there are some reports I trust more than others – though I can never trust any report blindly and fully. Different people have different taste and preferences concerning audio reproduction sets. Also, the overall sound of any piece of gear, an amp, for instance, is dependent on the rest of the setup, especially on the speakers and the room's acoustic.

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Originally Posted by janneman View Post
You can't escape your own conclusion: you must somehow use other parameters to select maybe a few projects, and listen for yourself, with the risk that it's not what you want. And while I agree that measurements don't tell you how an amp sounds, I DO know that an amp that measures well in a few significant areas at least doesn't add too much or subtract too much from the music. I would think that this would be a good starting point.
My experience doesn't support your statement that "an amp that measures well in a few significant areas at least doesn't add too much or subtract too much from the music". No PP power amp that I heard, tubes or SS, had the amount of details and microdynamics of a SET amp, while SET amps measure far worse than most PP amps (in THD, IMD and SNR). SET amps are far from being perfect and I cannot live with their shortcomings, however, it is obvious that THD, IMD and SNR tests fail to give even an approximate picture of the sound quality of an amp.

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Inevitably, unless you go for a finished product in a shop that you can audition, there's always the gambling element in a diy project to the outcome. Actually, the fact that we are so subjective and open for influence does help in this case: selecting a project that gets rave reviews increases the likelyhood that you too will like it.
Being retired, I don't have the money to buy good commercial amps.
From the reviews I read and from other data, I feel it wouldn't be much of a risk to build Allen Wright's published designs. Anyhow, it appears to me the best I can do in my present situation.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 01:43 PM   #5102
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Originally Posted by SY View Post
Again, if you have ANY actual data showing that ANYONE can hear the difference between a Blowtorch (or Ayre or whatever luxury unit) and a cheap IC opamp based linestage without peeking, I'm eager to see it.
I hear differences between different line stages, or preamps, without peaking. Would it be otherwise, I could save a lot of money. However, I'm not sure I can convince you. Actually, I'm not interested in convincing anyone. It's my money and my enjoyment of listening to reproduced music which I care about.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 01:49 PM   #5103
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Gee, wasn't it you for whom I wrote a detailed protocol for a listening test (I think it was wires), at your explicit request, taking quite a bit of my time, just to have you then say that you weren't really interested in doing a controlled test?
No, it wasn't me for whom you wrote any detailed protocol.

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If you haven't read my numerous posts about listening tests, methods, and controls, not to mention the custom-designed protocol you got from me, please read and understand them before totally making up things again. I realize that I'm not a great writer, but my stuff is reasonably understandable even to a non-native English speaker.
I didn't read all your posts.
It will make it easier should you post a link to relevant post(s) of yours.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 01:57 PM   #5104
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Originally Posted by Joshua_G View Post
No, it wasn't me for whom you wrote any detailed protocol.
You're right, it was Andre Visser. My apologies.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:07 PM   #5105
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You're right, it was Andre Visser. My apologies.
Going through my email, I see I indeed wrote the protocol for you. I unapologize.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:16 PM   #5106
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Ah ah, my brain returned as well.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:25 PM   #5107
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Originally Posted by Rod Coleman View Post
Yes, you'd have to read the whole thread to see the actual references to Doug's words.

As you say, I think we broadly agree, but my emphasis is much heavier against Audio Designers who do not give an account of listening assessment. I know that he makes useful remarks about certain design considerations, BUT, architecting an amp around what you can measure ONLY, is not good enough.[snip]
I don't know Rod; what if Doug Self would be waxing lyrical about the fantastic sound of his designs, would that help?
Or, would it convince you you'd absolutely want to build his design?
Chances are most people, probably including you, would fall over him for being prejudiced.

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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:25 PM   #5108
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Going through my email, I see I indeed wrote the protocol for you. I unapologize.
Now I'm confused, who did you send a protocol? I don't have any protocol sent by you.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:30 PM   #5109
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Originally Posted by Joshua_G View Post
Now I'm confused
Yes, apparently you are.
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Old 23rd July 2010, 04:30 PM   #5110
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Originally Posted by Joshua_G View Post
I hear differences between different line stages, or preamps, without peaking. [snip].
Indeed. Most psychoacousticians and other reasonable studied people would see a causal relationship here.

jd
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