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Old 18th May 2013, 10:03 AM   #39471
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonsai View Post
Remember TL's diatribe against it.
I am also frustrated by the article in the current Linear Audio on "hi-res" formats. Presenting physically impossible signals or ones that violate Nyquist as an argument for anything is a bad start. The dither and low low level tramsient arguments usually started with improper/no anti-aliasing on the input. First cycle distortion.

TL was right about one thing, by and large the industry has settled on some pretty bad AD/DA chips for even some above average gear. Reminds me of VHS players, circa 1985 you could get serious quality from the better ones and long before the medium died it was hard to find a quality recorder.

Another example. I had an Edirol UA5 external AD/DA years ago and was very happy with it THD and artifacts way down on both record and play. I rescently tried a supposedly SOTA external DA from China and it clipped on a SONY test CD of full scale test signals as well as barely making -90dB THD.
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Old 18th May 2013, 10:28 AM   #39472
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
I am also frustrated by the article in the current Linear Audio on "hi-res" formats. Presenting physically impossible signals or ones that violate Nyquist as an argument for anything is a bad start.
Scott, I'd be happy to run a Letter to the Editor....

jan
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Old 18th May 2013, 01:57 PM   #39473
gpapag is offline gpapag  Greece
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
TL was right about one thing, by and large the industry has settled on some pretty bad AD/DA chips for even some above average gear.
Scott, I think A/D is for audio far more important than cartridges.
Is it possible to explain what you mean by “some pretty bad AD/DA chips”.
Does it have to do with multibit/one bit decision or what?

George

PS. Who is TL ?
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Old 18th May 2013, 02:15 PM   #39474
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Thorsten (Lush) Lösch.
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Old 18th May 2013, 02:29 PM   #39475
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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Originally Posted by mikelm View Post
So for most hifi equiptment, a hifi show might well be the worst possible place to do demos.
True, but I see a lot of fancy power conditioners in audio show demo rooms. How well they work, I can't say, but at least some people are taking steps to fix the problem. You'll see some battery power, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
. Reminds me of VHS players, circa 1985 you could get serious quality from the better ones and long before the medium died it was hard to find a quality recorder.
A very good analogy, Scott. We sometimes blame the medium, when it fact it's just bad gear. At the shop we still have an object of fetish, a Sony Pro SVO-5800 S-VHS deck that cost several thousand dollars new. It's simply amazing. Used as a record/playback deck it rivals DVD quality. Even playing back commercially recorded tapes it looks better than you ever thought VHS could.

VHS is not a wonderful medium, but done right, it looks better than you ever thought it could. Much better. That comes at a high price, tho.
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Old 18th May 2013, 02:30 PM   #39476
gpapag is offline gpapag  Greece
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Originally Posted by jacco vermeulen View Post
Thorsten (Lush) Lösch.
Thank you.

George
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Old 18th May 2013, 02:38 PM   #39477
gpapag is offline gpapag  Greece
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Originally Posted by Pano View Post
True, but I see a lot of fancy power conditioners in audio show demo rooms.
And outrageous obsession with main's power distribution.

George
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Old 18th May 2013, 03:49 PM   #39478
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Originally Posted by gpapag View Post
And outrageous obsession with main's power distribution.
And I think the obsession is a bit Freudian. I bet they all have Enzyte in their medicine cabinets.

se
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Old 18th May 2013, 04:08 PM   #39479
RNMarsh is offline RNMarsh  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
TL was right about one thing, by and large the industry has settled on some pretty bad AD/DA chips for even some above average gear. .
It's depressing me -- the more I look into it for myself.

Which brands/models use the Analog Devices ADC/DAC?


-Richard

Last edited by RNMarsh; 18th May 2013 at 04:24 PM.
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Old 18th May 2013, 04:28 PM   #39480
Bonsai is offline Bonsai  Taiwan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott wurcer View Post
I am also frustrated by the article in the current Linear Audio on "hi-res" formats. Presenting physically impossible signals or ones that violate Nyquist as an argument for anything is a bad start. The dither and low low level tramsient arguments usually started with improper/no anti-aliasing on the input. First cycle distortion.

TL was right about one thing, by and large the industry has settled on some pretty bad AD/DA chips for even some above average gear. Reminds me of VHS players, circa 1985 you could get serious quality from the better ones and long before the medium died it was hard to find a quality recorder.

Another example. I had an Edirol UA5 external AD/DA years ago and was very happy with it THD and artifacts way down on both record and play. I rescently tried a supposedly SOTA external DA from China and it clipped on a SONY test CD of full scale test signals as well as barely making -90dB THD.
Well, I think the execution in most cases to blame. I bought a DAC here in Taiwan. The chassis earth was made to the case via the torroid mounting bolt . . .

Who knows what goes on on the PCB's and the output buffers.
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