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Old 11th May 2012, 08:06 PM   #23061
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Except that 'professors' often do the wine tasting double blind tests. Think about it, everyone.
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:13 PM   #23062
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With my flavor, i usually turn blind after the wine tasting.
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:14 PM   #23063
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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Amplifiers ABX tests amount to guess the glasses rather than a wine ,
hence the unability of most if not all audiophiles to notice a difference
unless an amp has awfull caracteristics...
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:14 PM   #23064
SY is offline SY  United States
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Yes, they do. Can you show me one article by a "professor" demonstrating that two different wines couldn't be distinguished blind? Professors do double blind tests because they're after what's the right answer, not promotion and fashion marketing.

Remember, for the third time, "distinguish" and "prefer" are two different terms.
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:26 PM   #23065
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Attached Files
File Type: pdf 2011-04-expensive-inexpensive-wines.pdf (7.9 KB, 41 views)
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:32 PM   #23066
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"The inexpensive wines cost less than £5 per bottle, and the expensive ones were priced between £10 and £30."

With wine prices like those, no wonder the tasters were blind.
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:36 PM   #23067
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I prefer that you distinguish between product topics that are productive and just the same old s....

Now what I find interesting is the tale of chicken sexers. They spend their 10,000 hours studying and then can tell by looking at a stage when most folks can't. They often can't explain exactly what the differences are verbally. Since they are paid for the work they do and fined when they get it wrong, the final results are accepted.

I suspect the ability to hear things others do not is sort of like that. There are particular distortion signatures that occur very infrequently, that with training (most self taught so far for audio, but some examples of "Listener Calibration") can be used to distinguish audio equipment characteristics. Because they are infrequent they can actually be fairly "Loud" (Say -25 below the instantaneous level) and easy to pick out, once trained to listen for them.

Now if a double blind test does not include these cues, then the results will be skewed.

The other issue is of course making sure the test is actually switching between sources correctly. I am still looking for a switch that measures much better than audio cables.

Now I do have some idea of what kinds of cues may be present that most miss. The ideas are based on the remarks used while doing comparisons. Remind me in 6 weeks and I may be able to post some tests.

ES
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:37 PM   #23068
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Perhaps the human mind must make some sense of these 'transcription errors'. My best guess is: 5 pounds, 10 pounds and 30 pounds. However, I could be mistaken. We all know that professors are a bunch of -----, and could not do a good test if they had to. '-)
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:37 PM   #23069
SY is offline SY  United States
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I take it you didn't actually read the actual paper, since nowhere in there is it suggested that the wines couldn't be distinguished. It was a classic demonstration of the need for double blind tests to remove bias and preconception. OK, want to try again?
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Old 11th May 2012, 08:42 PM   #23070
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I take it you didn't actually read it, since nowhere in there is it suggested that the wines couldn't be distinguished. OK, want to try again?
One of the fellows who used to work here, participated in wine tastings. For fun one time he took Thunderbird! He presented it as a popular wine for folks around where he work. The homeless shelter was just down the block.

It was well accepted and picked as a favorite by a few folks.

He actually left me a bottle which I served to more than one person who had an interest in wine. All but one thought it a good wine.

So it while it may be easy to distinguish one wine from another, beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.
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