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Old 28th October 2011, 12:06 AM   #17021
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What I would like to develop here, is NOT conclusions, but observed experiences and some 'explanations' as to why these experiences were observed, and not relegated to the standard formula of: Swamp gas, the planet Venus, etc. (with regards to UFO's, for example).
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Old 28th October 2011, 12:19 AM   #17022
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hitsware View Post

If the impedance was capacitance accross the output,
the higher impedance would be more sensitive to the
variations .......
That's generally not the dominant impedance except for some very few pathological cables. For a 5R output impedance and 3000pF of capacitance (quite high!), the f3 is about 10 MHz, which is even a bit high for bats.

Peter Aczel ran some nice sims using different speaker cables and a the impedance of a Carver loudspeaker as a load. A lot of frequency response variation, but a few ohms of source Z swamped the differences.
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Old 28th October 2011, 12:30 AM   #17023
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
That's generally not the dominant impedance except for some very few pathological cables. For a 5R output impedance and 3000pF of capacitance (quite high!), the f3 is about 10 MHz, which is even a bit high for bats.

Peter Aczel ran some nice sims using different speaker cables and a the impedance of a Carver loudspeaker as a load. A lot of frequency response variation, but a few ohms of source Z swamped the differences.
Not that long ago a massive thread on the subject of cables was locked mainly, I suspect, because it became clear that it was simply going around in circles; additionally a fair amount of bad feeling surfaced and at least one member - who got somewhat overwrought - was "resigned" from contributor status.

I know that JC - who owns this thread - is interested in the subject however I would counsel that the subject be passed over ....especially so now that I see which members are involving themselves. We must learn that some members will never change their position and we cannot but have yet another re-enactment of the subjectivist-empiricist debacle.
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Old 28th October 2011, 12:31 AM   #17024
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
...observed experiences and some 'explanations' as to why these experiences were observed...
Fair enough. But will you be happy if the 'explanations' are L,C,R or RFI? Or good/bad connections?
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Old 28th October 2011, 12:35 AM   #17025
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Fair enough. But will you be happy if the 'explanations' are L,C,R or RFI? Or good/bad connections?
Michael, Michael, Michael. If there's no mystery and it's all basic engineering, where is the room for gurus?
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Old 28th October 2011, 12:47 AM   #17026
brianco is offline brianco  Ireland
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Michael, Michael, Michael. If there's no mystery and it's all basic engineering, where is the room for gurus?
SY

Breath a sigh of relief!
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Old 28th October 2011, 01:47 AM   #17027
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Well... I'm just saying.

Gurus I don't know - but if placebo effect, imagination and wishful thinking are off the table as possible explanations, what about L,C,R and RFI? Are they considered valid reasons for a change in sound, or does the explanation have to be exotic?
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Old 28th October 2011, 02:36 AM   #17028
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianco View Post
Not that long ago a massive thread on the subject of cables was locked mainly, I suspect, because it became clear that it was simply going around in circles; additionally a fair amount of bad feeling surfaced and at least one member - who got somewhat overwrought - was "resigned" from contributor status.

I know that JC - who owns this thread - is interested in the subject however I would counsel that the subject be passed over ....especially so now that I see which members are involving themselves. We must learn that some members will never change their position and we cannot but have yet another re-enactment of the subjectivist-empiricist debacle.
I agree, I don't care anymore about the "I hear what I hear and I don't care what you say comments". So just say it and move on.
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Old 28th October 2011, 02:40 AM   #17029
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Originally Posted by SY View Post
Unfortunately, "because I say so" is not the same as data and evidence.
What I hear is a definite answer to me.
Indeed. It isn't a proof to others, yet, I don't seek to convince anyone else.
The main issue remains: AFAIK, no one can tell what inductance and what capacitance will give what sonic signature which is the main issue in the present discussion: capacitance and inductance may be the parameters influencing the "sound" of cables, however, when it comes to choosing a proper cable it cannot be done based on the capacitance and inductance data.
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Old 28th October 2011, 03:17 AM   #17030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianco View Post
.. we cannot but have yet another re-enactment of the subjectivist-empiricist debacle.
Never seen one of those on this thread. Just objectivist-empiricist ones. Got a link?
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