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Old 24th April 2011, 03:22 PM   #11871
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaféNoir View Post
My opinion too,
Somehow hifi magazine often imply that boring and sterile sound relates to neutrality and technically capable gear, falling into the "transparency vs. musicality" cliche.
Sure be we know that distortion makes for a LESS boring sound. All kinds of extra harmonics, intermods etc. That really 'spices up' your sound, makes it 'emotionally involving'. SE tubes being a point in case.

jan didden
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Old 24th April 2011, 03:24 PM   #11872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnferrier View Post
Or, Nelson and Bob worked together ?


.
Or, ask the man himself:

http://www.linearaudio.nl/interviews/np.pdf

So he doesn't mention working with Bob, but he did say there are he few he doesn't want to metion.
So, it's all hidden in the cloak of time...

jan didden
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Last edited by jan.didden; 24th April 2011 at 03:29 PM.
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Old 24th April 2011, 03:42 PM   #11873
vuki is offline vuki  Croatia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janneman View Post
Yes, could be, but that's irrelevant here, isn't it?
The point is that they rated the one that they thought was most neutral, last.

jan
I think that exactly because they are not "technical" people they use the words less literally. So "neutral" doesn't have to mean neutral - it could also mean "sterile", "lifeless" etc. If we can't compare measurements of reviewed DACs we can't say anything about reviewers listening preferences vs. technical performance. Actually you are criticizing their use of words.
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Old 24th April 2011, 03:47 PM   #11874
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I doubt that Nelson Pass had very much, if anything to do with Carver's designs, at least from the beginning. Bob Carver worked with Geoff Cook and Bascom King in those early days. Geoff was the guy who got him 'on the map' so to speak. As consultants, both Nelson and I have worked for many companies. They usually take what they can and go elsewhere, so one tends to work for a whole stream of them, over the decades.
Since Nelson Pass is here on this website, AND even sometimes contributes to this thread, why not ask HIM?
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Old 24th April 2011, 03:50 PM   #11875
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Right on, vuki. And even IF there were real sonic differences, what design 'compromises' made these differences? I'm surprised that even 'sonic differences' are accepted by many around here.
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Old 24th April 2011, 04:24 PM   #11876
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When I was at ESS in '73, Bob Carver came to visit and have
lunch. Afterwards we took a picture of him assembling a
piece of ESS electronics.

That's as close I got to working with him.

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Old 24th April 2011, 04:26 PM   #11877
vuki is offline vuki  Croatia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john curl View Post
I'm surprised that even 'sonic differences' are accepted by many around here.
C'mon; nowdays is even D. Self starting to believe in burn-in.
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Old 24th April 2011, 07:12 PM   #11878
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It takes many years, about 30. '-)
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Old 24th April 2011, 08:48 PM   #11879
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I would like to comment on something that bothers me on this thread. That is general 'badmouthing' or 'criticism of someone else's research, without the researcher being placed in a position to respond. In this case today, it is 'Cheever's Thesis', over the years, it has been: Otala, Bybee and Hawksford, to name 3 other examples.
This is very 'sophomoric' to attack someone behind their back, especially without stating specifics. I hope that it does not continue here, if at all possible.
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Old 24th April 2011, 09:12 PM   #11880
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OK, so if something is wrong, no-one should say anything. Unless, of course, it's someone YOU disagree with (like Lipshitz's work or the guys who published the ABX stuff), then it's fine.

Riiiiiiight.
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