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Old 25th December 2010, 07:39 PM   #131
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peckerwood View Post
That is interesting. Is it true that you guys still do not clink your mugs even though 150 years has past? How do the people feel about Görgey?
Yes, that's right. Some might say, this is just an urban legend. Well may be, there is no written trace of this tradition. But I think this is why it's a folk tradition. Any case, I consider myself to this. This does not necessarily mean that I have aversions against the Austrians. (or beer.) Why would this be so? Just because they are luckier than us? Although ...

Think Görgey Arthúr is one of the tragic figures of Hungarian history. The situation resulting from his only bad decision can, or even worse. He lived in 98 years ...
This is what I call a tragedy.
I just know.

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Old 26th December 2010, 04:33 AM   #132
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That is really interesting. The reason I asked how the people feel about him is because I have spent considerable time with many people from Russia and they are so different than we are (although in some ways they are so the same too). I mean it seems to me like obviously the people would hate him but I learned from the Russians that a lot of people around the world do not see things anywhere near the same way we do.

Or by tragic figure do you mean the people despise him? Americans would think of him like we think of Benidict Arnold if it happened here. Tragic figure to most Americans would be somebody we have a lot of sympathy for. We would not have much sympathy for him if he were American and we have no sympathy for Arnold.

I can tell you are very intelligent and articulate and you speak English a lot better than I could speak any other language but a lot of times I am not sure exactly what you mean. You know the language very well but your grammar is not the best. It is like you put all the right words into each sentence but not in the right order. Talking with people on here is probably the best way to improve it so I encourage you to continue.



I removed about 3 paragraphs from this because it could be considered political (although I was only trying to give examples of why I mentioned the Russians in the first place). Really anything that is not purely about equipment COULD be considered political by some people but maybe we can talk somewhere else sometime if you would like to.
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Old 21st January 2011, 06:00 PM   #133
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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I am compelled to introduce the easiest way possible.
First, because I do not know English.
We have a saying to us:
Who does not know Arabic, they do not speak Arabic.

But my thoughts when I'm trying to say in Hungarian, it is perhaps even they do not understand people whose mother tongue is Hungarian.
So I have to struggle with English.
Görgei Artur was not a traitor.
The tragedy of his own in which he was forced to do so.
There was virtually no other choice but unconditional surrender.
Moreover, the traitor label hung on Görgei by governor Lajos Kossuth.
He is the one who fled the country, but before this he gave the full power of this Gorgei handed.

I see a clear distinction here between a politician and a soldier.

Let's see the facts:
Gorgei thirty-one thousand, leaving a tired due to military operations and the army was facing shortage of ammunition.
Against the Russian army hundred and fifty thousand-strong army and the Austrian army, although such staff.
This ten-fold superiority!
I wonder what he could have done?
Let's see what little I could ascertain the history of Benedict Arnold.
His military talent was undoubtedly, as our Görgei.
But I do not see a compelling force that caused him to have to stand on the other side.
Although I see some economic reasons would have been like this.

Benedict Arnold is a betrayer in my eye in brief.
Görgei Arthur is a tragic hero conversely.

Gyuri
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Old 21st January 2011, 06:42 PM   #134
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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Anyway I had long meant to ask intelligent American people:

Why the U.S. believe that the only correct position for what they represent?

It's probably just a some centuries-old history, to over-compensate for the lack of minority feeling?
Possibly it (undoubtedly) the justification of committed sins?
Possibly because the winner is always right?
The things never so plain, I know.
Let us remember my statement:
There is not absolute truth, there are viewpoints differing only.
But I consider it dangerous, if somebody beyond any doubt is keeping up with his own truth.
I undertake my opinion if I attract the gods' anger with this!

Gyuri

P.S.:
But maybe, that all is for the reason that the personality cult was deepest in his bundles at us only:
The person who there is not with us is against us.
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Old 21st January 2011, 07:17 PM   #135
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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Yet some thoughts, I leave you in peace afterwards:
I hated the American films always, in which vegetates the treasury optimism.
The characters are up to their neck in the s'hit:
Somebody speaks up:
- It'll be fine!
Well, will not be, because it is s'hit already!
The societies being built on the lie do not have future.
Neither U.S., neither somewhere else on the world.
We may know that the largest tragedies occurred after the collapse of the realms.
See it: Dark Middle Ages (After Holy Roman Empire), Osztrák-Magyar Monarchy, USSR, Yugoslavia, etc.

So, I am Wacky:
Gyuri
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Old 22nd January 2011, 03:27 PM   #136
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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If we do not ask, certainly do not get answers.
It seems to me sometimes when we ask, in this case, we shall not get any answers.

The rhetorical question does not wait for an answer finally.
Because the question itself is the answer, too.
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Old 22nd January 2011, 11:36 PM   #137
eyoung is offline eyoung  United States
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It seems that we are afraid to ask the question because we know the answer but are afraid to aknowlege that the inevitable outcome is something we do not want to think about.

whistling in the dark,Your friend
Elwood
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Old 23rd January 2011, 05:51 AM   #138
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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I always knew that you are a wise man, my dear friend!
Gyuri
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Old 17th February 2011, 07:09 PM   #139
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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Father and son.
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Old 15th March 2011, 05:49 PM   #140
Gyuri is offline Gyuri  Hungary
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I am thinking about it many times if the numerical superiority of the imperial powers does not drown it into blood the 1848 Hungarian revolution, how the world history develops then?
I do not know that it would be better or worse, but that it been some other way, it is sure.
Let us not forget it, this happened to 15 years before American civil war.
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