so the main thing about heavy metal sound is the hard clipping.. but do some here use another configuration about the diodes.. I see some designs that one diode in parallel with two series diodes. but on the other hand i never heard that configuration yet. I only experience the two diodes in parallel clipping the signal at the output. Would there any be diode configuration or what diode was used for a more heavy metal sound... By the way guys thanks for the reply.
Here is a valve typoe distortion circuit.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The one with the transistors in the feedback is indeed a nice one. I once used something a little similar as soft-clipping circuit at the input of a power amp.
The topology with the single and double diodes paralleled (post #4) is intended to give some even order harmonics. Symmetrically clipping circuits (i.e. the ones with equal amount of diodes paralleled) will only produce odd order harmonics.
There are in fact tons of possibilities to combine resistors and diodes to generate whatever characteristic someone likes: Soft or hard-clipping, even- or odd order harmonics or a mixture of both.
A circuit like the last one could also be made in a staggered fashion with two or more pairs of transistors where each pair has an own pot and different sized emitter resistors. Eg first pair 470k, snd pair 100k etc. When the two resistors of one pair are not equal, one is also getting some even order harmonics. So if you use a 200k pot instead of a 100 k resistor for one of the emitter resistors you might also be able to play around with symmetry.
Regards
Charles
The topology with the single and double diodes paralleled (post #4) is intended to give some even order harmonics. Symmetrically clipping circuits (i.e. the ones with equal amount of diodes paralleled) will only produce odd order harmonics.
There are in fact tons of possibilities to combine resistors and diodes to generate whatever characteristic someone likes: Soft or hard-clipping, even- or odd order harmonics or a mixture of both.
A circuit like the last one could also be made in a staggered fashion with two or more pairs of transistors where each pair has an own pot and different sized emitter resistors. Eg first pair 470k, snd pair 100k etc. When the two resistors of one pair are not equal, one is also getting some even order harmonics. So if you use a 200k pot instead of a 100 k resistor for one of the emitter resistors you might also be able to play around with symmetry.
Regards
Charles
Hello Jyango,
I will tell you what took me a long time to learn (in the pre-internet days) and what other had consequently told me. The type of distortion you want to achieve will be more defined by the type of equalisation you put on it (whether it be before or after, most often after the distortion circuit), rather than hard or soft clipping. Solid-state devices will generate tons of harmonics all over the audible spectrum, and that makes up for all the buzzy, tinny, ziiziziziy sounds you hear that just break my ears. You know icicles? Well, it would be sort of like jamming those in your ears.
Anyway, even after you build your circuit and you find yourself wondering "why doesn't it sound like I want?" (whatever that may be) remember, you need to tailor the distorted signal to remove the unwanted harmonics generated in the upper mids to the highs.
The only other way to get a decent metal sound is do what the pros do: Get a Marshall 50W non-master volume head and a 4x12 cabinet, Bass to 3, mids to 4, high to 5 and crank it up...
Wear earplugs too, if you want to conserve your ears!
I will tell you what took me a long time to learn (in the pre-internet days) and what other had consequently told me. The type of distortion you want to achieve will be more defined by the type of equalisation you put on it (whether it be before or after, most often after the distortion circuit), rather than hard or soft clipping. Solid-state devices will generate tons of harmonics all over the audible spectrum, and that makes up for all the buzzy, tinny, ziiziziziy sounds you hear that just break my ears. You know icicles? Well, it would be sort of like jamming those in your ears.
Anyway, even after you build your circuit and you find yourself wondering "why doesn't it sound like I want?" (whatever that may be) remember, you need to tailor the distorted signal to remove the unwanted harmonics generated in the upper mids to the highs.
The only other way to get a decent metal sound is do what the pros do: Get a Marshall 50W non-master volume head and a 4x12 cabinet, Bass to 3, mids to 4, high to 5 and crank it up...
Wear earplugs too, if you want to conserve your ears!
I found the soft clipping circuit required plenty of top so I added a presence stage.
LOL I.M.D.? Where? LOL
why dont you just replace the diodes with LED's as some smart bloke pointed out? besides the fact youll have to nearly triple gain to get from the usual .6v of a silicon diode, to the 1.2-1.5v for a diode.
if you want to experiment get three diodes:
germanium-for the softest overdrive clipping
silicon- for mental odd harms
maybe try schottky diodes ???
just dont play 2 strings at the same time or the IMD may make your ears bleed!!!
personally id rather just try and make one using rectifier valves..old school tech, but some serious fuzz possible...
why dont you just replace the diodes with LED's as some smart bloke pointed out? besides the fact youll have to nearly triple gain to get from the usual .6v of a silicon diode, to the 1.2-1.5v for a diode.
if you want to experiment get three diodes:
germanium-for the softest overdrive clipping
silicon- for mental odd harms
maybe try schottky diodes ???
just dont play 2 strings at the same time or the IMD may make your ears bleed!!!
personally id rather just try and make one using rectifier valves..old school tech, but some serious fuzz possible...
lol THAT and all the IMD products that hard clipping produces.......EQ doesnt shift them, but it may make up for the spectral imbalance; however, full on valve overdrive (or valve rectifiers) have a far better sound as it also took me a long time to realise.
LOL theres nothing like downtuning(double drop c) to CGDGBE cranking the quad el84's up nice and crunchy!
For my heavy sound i use my rackmount 120watt dean markely valvehead, along with hartke 4x10 bass cab!! growly, warm , bright enough yet not tizzy or over sharp
maybe not a logical choice , but truth is, its as dark as youd ever need and as bright as id ever want when fully OD, and at 120watt, damned loud too.
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don't forget to put some resistor devider at the end to bring the level back to what the amplifier's built foor..
Well, if we don'T know what the guy's intentions are (lead or rythm) it's hard to suggest an appropriate circuit much less device.
As you said, IMD with either type of diode will be unsupportable if you do more than one note, meaning you can't get a good crunchy chord sound. Frankly I found the best results were obtained with LOW distortion setting, low mids and almost no treble. But turn the volume up. And have a 12 inch speaker because anything smaller will sound wimpy.
We need to know what he wants. Chords or soloing?they're simply not the same type of distortion.
The only point I disagree with is when you said diode clipping is the main thing about heavy metal sound. Diode clipping is not even a thing much less a main thing to as lot of us. In fact to me it is something I avoid whenever possible. I guess I could even say diode clipping is the most important thing NOT to have for me personally. I guess a solid state amp would be worse but then again with diode clipping you have a partially solid state amp. Depends where you draw the line between solid state and tube. I wouldn't consider an amp with a solid state rectifier a solid state amp but I suppose some people might.
I play pretty heavy stuff and I hate diode clipping. I have a Marshall JCM 900 50 watt head with that crap. I only use it for a spare because I can't stand it but I got it too cheap not to buy it and I didn't know I would hate it. I have never had to actually use it yet but I recorded enough with it to know for sure I will not be recording with it ever again and hopefully never have to use it live either. It does sound like a lot of popular "metal" bands though. It sucks. Solid state rigs have that similar "artificial" quality to their sound that diode clipping causes only worse.
I get what I consider a real good (but never as good as I know it can be) heavy big sound using my Marshall MK2 Superlead 100 watt or my Marshall 70s JMP 100 watt (JMPs now are rackmounts and totally different amps). The JMP has been "boogied". All I know is it has 4 pre-amp tubes instead of the 3 it was made with and the mod is supposedly called a "Langer" mod or something. It sounds like World War 3. It will distort a lot. Neither of those have that diode clipping crap. The MK2 is kind of clean but it is so punchy it still just blows anything with diode clipping away. It is really bright too. Diode clipping seems to muddle things up a little to me anyway. It sounds similar to an AC-DC kind of sound with 6550 output tubes in it (which it came with) but mine distorts a little more without loosing the punch because I have 6L6s in it.
I play pretty heavy stuff and I hate diode clipping. I have a Marshall JCM 900 50 watt head with that crap. I only use it for a spare because I can't stand it but I got it too cheap not to buy it and I didn't know I would hate it. I have never had to actually use it yet but I recorded enough with it to know for sure I will not be recording with it ever again and hopefully never have to use it live either. It does sound like a lot of popular "metal" bands though. It sucks. Solid state rigs have that similar "artificial" quality to their sound that diode clipping causes only worse.
I get what I consider a real good (but never as good as I know it can be) heavy big sound using my Marshall MK2 Superlead 100 watt or my Marshall 70s JMP 100 watt (JMPs now are rackmounts and totally different amps). The JMP has been "boogied". All I know is it has 4 pre-amp tubes instead of the 3 it was made with and the mod is supposedly called a "Langer" mod or something. It sounds like World War 3. It will distort a lot. Neither of those have that diode clipping crap. The MK2 is kind of clean but it is so punchy it still just blows anything with diode clipping away. It is really bright too. Diode clipping seems to muddle things up a little to me anyway. It sounds similar to an AC-DC kind of sound with 6550 output tubes in it (which it came with) but mine distorts a little more without loosing the punch because I have 6L6s in it.
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