Bass guitar amp/speakers - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Live Sound > Instruments and Amps

Instruments and Amps Everything that makes music, Especially including instrument amps.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 24th September 2005, 10:18 PM   #1
Jorge is offline Jorge  Brazil
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Brazil
Default Bass guitar amp/speakers

Hello,

My younger son plays bass guitar semi professionally (he's a music student at the university).

I'm considering to buid for him a new amp/boxes combo, and would like a bit of your collective wisdom...

- Why are 4 x 10" speakers used for the high bass/lo mids box (and not just one)?
- Are class D amp (quite possibly Tripath based) reliable enough for this usage?

What I have in mind is a bi-ampli system, electronic Xo, 15" bass box (from 40Hz), something for high bass/lo mids, and a horn tweeter.

Power would be 300W/channel, class D, clasic power supply (not SMPS).

Thanks for your help,
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 01:27 AM   #2
Tim__x is offline Tim__x  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Edmonton area, Alberta
4x10"s are used for the slight boost in efficiency.

A well made class D amp is more than reliable enough.

Euphonic Audio and Acoustic Image make class D bass amps. A large number of other companies make class D PA amps.

Bass cabinets really only need an f3 of 40-60hz, I would look in to PA drivers.

This section of the forum is pretty dead, you may want to ask in the loudspeaker and class D sections.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 04:15 AM   #3
Jorge is offline Jorge  Brazil
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Brazil
Thanks, Tim

I've posted it here because I'm looking for user's opinion, and I felt the other forum posters may not be familiar with the pro/semi pro music environment (I for one!)...

The speakers I'm considering are PA ones, and the 15" in a ported box will go from 40Hz and produce 120dB @1m @300W.

Re the 4 x 10", if it's efficiency, one 10" (of the same make) is slightly more efficient - 120dB @1m @180W.
And with a 4th order L-R Xo at about 200~250Hz power handling (excursion) will be OK for a flat power response.

So, I feel I can do it with only a 15 and a 10 (plus horn). Reason is that he have to carry his gear around, so the smaller/lighter the better!
Same for the class D amp (but at least the first version will not have a SMPS).
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 04:59 AM   #4
Brion55 is offline Brion55  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Kansas
Send a message via Yahoo to Brion55
Had you thought of putting the 10" in a short, front loaded horn enclosure to increase efficiency? I've seen this done with good success.
__________________
How do I put the smoke back in this thing?
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 02:00 PM   #5
Jorge is offline Jorge  Brazil
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Brazil
Thanks, Brion55

No, I didn't, due to size/weight constraints.

But why more efficiency if the 10" is already more efficient than the 15" one? Wouldn't the setup sound 'thinner' ?
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 09:26 PM   #6
diyAudio Member
 
Brett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Default Re: Bass guitar amp/speakers

Quote:
Originally posted by Jorge
I'm considering to buid for him a new amp/boxes combo, and would like a bit of your collective wisdom...

- Why are 4 x 10" speakers used for the high bass/lo mids box (and not just one)?
As Tim said, for the sfficiency. However 4x10 cabs have some weird phasing issues depending on where you stand in front of them. Never heard a 4x10 I liked. They're also a weird shape that's hard to load into a car or move or carry
Quote:
- Are class D amp (quite possibly Tripath based) reliable enough for this usage?

Power would be 300W/channel, class D, clasic power supply (not SMPS).
This si what I'm using for my rig at the moment. No reliability issues so far and a heck of a lot less weight. I have fans on the amp modules, blowing both across the heatsing and the PCB's. Not neccessary, but I like electronics cool, I had them anyway and I run the fans slow.
Quote:
What I have in mind is a bi-ampli system, electronic Xo, 15" bass box (from 40Hz), something for high bass/lo mids, and a horn tweeter.
This is basically what my big rig will use, except I have a PAudio SN12C coax 12" (neo) because I got it for peanuts. I'm going to replace the HF driver with a BMS4552ND. When I get the BMS, I'll triamp, simply because I have a small T amp to drive it.

As you're in Brazil, are Selenium drivers cheap there? A rig consisting of
- WPU1505, ported. I haven't run the numbers but should be good.
- 10PW3 may be enough (Xmax is a bit low for my tates) in a sealed box. 300Hz xover.
- D205 on a flare that matches the dispersion of the MF driver at the xover freq, maybe the 5625?
It's a little bit of overkill, but I like my rig to be clean and loud, then use the pre and effects to shape the tone, so I have max flexibility. This is basically how my big rig was built before I got the PAudio neo coax. The 12" Selenium coax would be good too if it fits within budget.
Not sure what else is available to you locally.

Some suggestions:
- build the 15" into a box of it's own, and the 10 + horn into another. Reason is that depending upon how you shape the LF enclosure, you may be able to fit it into rear seats or boots (trunks) of cars more easily. The smaller bulk and mass are easier to shift and are better for the back to lift up and down. If your son also has to move his rig into backstage areas with poor or narrow access, this will be a lot easier.
- place the handles (and use steel ones) once the box is built so you can find the balance points of the box and the best position to lift it easily. After a long gig, your son will thank you for this.
- don't carpet the box(es) because it picks up smells like stale cigarettes and beer. Vinyl, epoxy or Rodkhard paint are better.
- buy a cheap furniture removalist's dolly to move the gear from the vehicle to the stage.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th September 2005, 11:31 PM   #7
Jorge is offline Jorge  Brazil
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Brazil
Thanks, Brett

Speakers - unbelievable, but you can purchase Selenium in the US cheaper than we pay over here!

I intend to use Snake ESX155 and ESX310

http://www.snakepro.com/english/products.htm

It seems a decent brand, better prices than Selenium. My simulations shows Xo at 200~250Hz.

Your suggestions are quite in line with my thoughs - a ported cube for the 15", a closed box for the 10", horn and power amp.
Preamp, at least in the first version will be his foot pedals!

And very nice handling suggestions!

Take care,
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th September 2005, 08:56 PM   #8
Brion55 is offline Brion55  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Kansas
Send a message via Yahoo to Brion55
When you finish your project, post a photo so we can see it!
__________________
How do I put the smoke back in this thing?
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2005, 07:20 PM   #9
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
How much are the snake pro's and where can you buy them also would their speakers and their tweeter be good for bass cabs Also how good are the selenium's
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th September 2005, 03:39 AM   #10
Jorge is offline Jorge  Brazil
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Brazil
Snake: I don't know how much they would cost or where they are sold out of Brazil, but here's the US contact:

Doug Holmquist
8074 Esterbrook Drive
Nashville TN USA
37221
Phone / Fax: (615) 516-0878

Selenium is a long standing brand, highly regarded for PA and musical instruments.
Parts Express for one sells it.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
4x12 Guitar cab using guitar and bass speakers help andrewskaterrr Instruments and Amps 15 23rd April 2009 11:43 PM
Built differences between Guitar Speakers and PA Speakers? agadis PA Systems 7 24th September 2007 08:22 AM
any electric bass players? im building a bass guitar cab KOA Instruments and Amps 27 30th April 2007 03:49 PM
New Speakers for 2x15" bass guitar cabinet. Nate Groadie Multi-Way 0 20th May 2003 03:38 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 05:30 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2