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Old 15th February 2005, 06:25 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by SirPoonga
"- flat response to 40Hz is not always a benefit on stage. Can muddy up everything. Many people are happy with 4x10's etc which seldom have much below 80Hz."

I was thinking about this too. That's what EQs are for, right?
Not really. Box size, efficiency and LF response are intimately connected, and Hoffman's Iron Law states you can only have two of them. As you're not going the get the same absolute level from a 12 (limited volume displacement) optimise for 80Hz f3 (this may allow a sealed box too for better transient response) and take the efficiency gain. If you want more low end, get a 15 and another poweramp later.
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Old 15th February 2005, 06:34 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Brett
One thing I can not find info here on is how would one bridge the two boards that comes with the chipamp.com kit?
It's in the Nat Semi app note (#1192?). [/B]
Yep, but has anyone bridged the two boards that come in the chipamp.com kit, IE it may be possible for me to see pics and what wires went where when bridging the two boards.

I know the app note tells how to bridge, I was wondering if anyone did it specifically with that chipamp.com kit.

Right now I think I have enough info to start diagramming out how to piece this all together.
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Old 15th February 2005, 06:37 PM   #13
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One last question before I start piecing all the parts together. Would this be better suited for guitar then? A friend of mine saw me working on this project ans was wondering about that.
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Old 15th February 2005, 06:50 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by SirPoonga
One last question before I start piecing all the parts together. Would this be better suited for guitar then? A friend of mine saw me working on this project ans was wondering about that.
There is a current thread here re the use of chipamps as guitar amps. Would 'work' fine, especially as a practice/jam amp, but whether you like the tone or not is another story, ie don't expect it to sound like a Marshall. Tone in guitar amps is much more individual and personal in preference than in bass amps which generally tend to be clean, almost hifi a lot of the time.

I'd also use a specific guitar speaker and not the Delta12.
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Old 15th February 2005, 06:59 PM   #15
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Originally posted by Brett
There is a current thread here re the use of chipamps as guitar amps.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=51015&goto=newpost
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Old 15th February 2005, 07:01 PM   #16
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Right, obviously would use the proper speaker and cabinet for guitar.

Yeah, I know guitarist are pretty picky on sound. He wants this Vox 30W tube amp with an effects memory or something or other. Sounds cool. He was curious more than anything. I'll have to search around on the forum.
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Old 16th February 2005, 04:19 PM   #17
R.G. is offline R.G.  United States
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I'm not a bassist, only a broken-down guitarist, but the broken-down part is what is doing a lot of talking these days. I'm over 50, and I can't haul around 100 pound cabinets like I used to.

I did some poking around and found Len Moskowitz' small bass cab article (http://www.core-sound.com/bottom-article.html)on line, and a follow up (http://www.billsbest.com/thbasscab.html).

The idea is not particularly that incremental amps are the cheapest solution, or the best possible. The idea is that they represent manageable chunks, both in dollars and in physical hauling. They are also compatible with distributing the speakers out to where you want the sound, and in the direction you want the sound. They'e optimized for flexibility, which is usually not what other audio systems are optimized for.
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Old 16th February 2005, 05:50 PM   #18
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Originally posted by R.G.
I'm not a bassist, only a broken-down guitarist, but the broken-down part is what is doing a lot of talking these days. I'm over 50, and I can't haul around 100 pound cabinets like I used to.
I don't like hauling around big cabs or a lot of weight either, hence my earlier suggestion of Bill Fitzmaurices Tuba 24.

My 'big' rig was also designed to fit onto a stairwalker trolley, so it can be slid out of the back of a wagon/van and simply wheeled into place. It's seldom needed, so as I said, I use a smaller cab or a combo of them. The JBL 15 will be replaced soon by a Beyma 15 in a cab tuned to about 40Hz, taking 60l (2.1 cu ft) of volume, 700W, 97dB efficiency and weighing around 30kg.

Quote:
I did some poking around and found Len Moskowitz' small bass cab article (http://www.core-sound.com/bottom-article.html)on line, and a follow up (http://www.billsbest.com/thbasscab.html).
Compare what this setup can do compared to mine; several dB (~7) less efficient, with the attendant power compression in large increases in distortion of a domestic driver, or extra power requirements (8x) in about 0.6cu ft extra and maybe some extra weight; I use quality ply rather than the MDF of the original author to make a lighter, stronger and more weatherproof box. If I use the Neo driver, it'll weigh less with far better performance.
Quote:
The idea is not particularly that incremental amps are the cheapest solution, or the best possible. The idea is that they represent manageable chunks, both in dollars and in physical hauling. They are also compatible with distributing the speakers out to where you want the sound, and in the direction you want the sound. They'e optimized for flexibility, which is usually not what other audio systems are optimized for.
I'm not disagreeing with the incremental idea, I just think you're looking at it the wrong way. To equal the performance of only my 15" box, you'd need at least 3 of the box you're describing, which you are not going to be able to do in anything like the same weight or form factor. I also don't beleive that the Moskowitz will adequately keep up with shredding guitarist with a decent stack, and a drummer who actually hits hard.

Build a ported 1x10 or 2x10 (+horn) to get say 70Hz f3 and run it off the chip amps with a suitable pre. Later, build a 1x15 (+ horn too if you want) and run that off a seperate slave poweramp, built or bought, off a secondary output of the pre. Use them both seperately or together (plug the ports in the smaller cab) depending on what's required, and think carefully about the ergonomics as you build them for weight balance, safe lifting etc and get a small trolley to move them about. On this last point, my bigger rig rolls into place, is powered up, and never leaves the trolley. With a bass in a backpack type softcase, I can usually move the entire rig in, on my own (I'm not young either) including the bass in one trip with no setup or breakdown.
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Old 16th February 2005, 09:37 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Brett
I don't like hauling around big cabs or a lot of weight either, hence my earlier suggestion of Bill Fitzmaurices Tuba 24.
I am looking at the graphic for that. That doesn't look like a pleasant sound the way the the db spikes at 62-80Hz.

The Tuba 18 on the other hand.... add a mid or tweeter and that could sound decent according to the graphic.

Or even the Tuba 30 maybe.

I'm a little confuse on the autotuba. Will have to research when I have a day with mroe time
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Old 16th February 2005, 11:09 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by SirPoonga
I am looking at the graphic for that. That doesn't look like a pleasant sound the way the the db spikes at 62-80Hz.
Bill is a bassist and has a forum on another site. Ask him what he thinks and look at posts from other builders.
http://audioroundtable.com/BillFitzmaurice/

Don't get hung up on FR, it doesn't mean a lot because as soon as you put it in a room it's response is going to be radically different (this goes for all speakers). One of the reasons you seldom see a FR of lots of MI speakers is that it can look like the Himalayas; the box is part of the creation of the sound. Play your bass/guitar through your hifi and usually it sounds bland.
The peak around 60-80 isn't that uncommon in smaller bass boxes as it emphasises the second harmonic region of the bottom two string's fundamentals (B=31, E=41Hz). The fundamentals actually measure weak on a lot of basses and it's 2H which gives us a lot of the information about pitch and tone. This is easily proven; listen to a small bookshelf speaker with say a 4" bass driver. There's no way it can be producing the fundamental, but it's still possible to follow along with what the bassist is doing. Your ear/brain interface 'regenerates' the fundamental.
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