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Old 28th September 2013, 11:39 PM   #1
hewo is offline hewo  United States
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Default cascade preamp stages CD4049

hi everyone,
1. need help prototype schematic CD4049 low level guitar signal cascade multi-stage soft clipping preamplifier.
2. nobody wants to utilize all six stages of cascading but why? noisy? battery dead too soon?
3. wouldn't delightful sound come from gradually boosting signal through many stages to obtain soft clipping progressively via multi-stages cascade topology?
4. web shows up to three stages but no more - the rest of the inverters are idle.
5. isn't small gains per stage better to arrive at the final soft clipping arena? doesn't this boost conservative approach broaden spectrum per stage?
6. or does this invite excessive guitarist controls that would confuse and frustrate the guitarist? at minimum would need a pot or trimmer per each stage feedback - and these umbilicals would crosstalk in the physical wiring birdnest?
7. figure on 2mA per inverter railed by two separate lithium DC supplies, 1.5V, totalizes to 12mA much too excessive?
8. any help much appreciated - will utilize surface mount CD4049 as it is significantly tinier than the DIP
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Old 29th September 2013, 07:20 PM   #2
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
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This would more properly be placed in Instruments and Amps where someone might be able to help you..

I'll move it.
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Old 29th September 2013, 09:23 PM   #3
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The CD4049 is an inverter, not an amplifier. Maybe that is why. It is effectively a digital switch.
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Old 29th September 2013, 09:43 PM   #4
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
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It can be configured as an inverting amplifier and it's commonly done. (I'm not saying it is a good amplifier)

You need to look at the allowable supply voltage range of the CD4049.

No idea whether this will get you where you want to be.
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Old 29th September 2013, 10:17 PM   #5
shanx is offline shanx  Canada
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It is possible to do it but the noise levels will increase accordingly per stage, maybe to the point of being unworkable. No harm in trying it though.
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Old 30th September 2013, 05:04 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanx View Post
It is possible to do it but the noise levels will increase accordingly per stage, maybe to the point of being unworkable. No harm in trying it though.
Basically you're suggesting making apple pies from tomatoes (both red and round, right?) and then saying it doesn't taste right.

If you're going down that path, you might try a 4069 which is closer to linear than the buffered 4049. There are a lot of crystal oscillators using the 4069.

G
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Old 30th September 2013, 12:33 PM   #7
shanx is offline shanx  Canada
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Quote:
Basically you're suggesting making apple pies from tomatoes (both red and round, right?) and then saying it doesn't taste right
What I was suggesting is to try adding an extra inverter stage onto the first 2 or 3 and see if the noise level is acceptable. If the gains are set low in each stage, it may be alright. Depends on one's taste whether it's ''right''. CD 4069, being closer to linear, possibly matters less in an overdrive circuit which is ultimately non linear.
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Old 30th September 2013, 11:40 PM   #8
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Old 1st October 2013, 04:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanx View Post
What I was suggesting is to try adding an extra inverter stage onto the first 2 or 3 and see if the noise level is acceptable. If the gains are set low in each stage, it may be alright. Depends on one's taste whether it's ''right''. CD 4069, being closer to linear, possibly matters less in an overdrive circuit which is ultimately non linear.
So go to a comparator and play with different values of hysteresis. It will be very non linear if that's the goal.

G
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Old 1st October 2013, 12:44 PM   #10
shanx is offline shanx  Canada
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Yes, a comparator circuit would be very non-linear, hard clipped .It would be more of a fuzz pedal than an overdrive/distortion circuit. I built a 2 stage 4049 (based on Craig Anderton circuit) and it sounds pretty decent, overdrives pretty early so with some lower gain on individual stages and some additional tone shaping per stage,3 or 4 stages will likely sound pretty good. With 6 stages it probably would sound a lot more like a fuzz pedal too.
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