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Old 1st June 2013, 11:30 AM   #1
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Default A Through-hole "Wire" Amp

Hey, guys. I recently found the "the wire" here on this forum and wanted to build one for myself. Given the lack of boards and the fact that I have loads of through-hole parts laying around, I decided to try my hand at designing a through-hole version of the PSU and SE-SE boards. I tossed it together in eagle. Everything's included in the zip. If anyone feels like doing some sanity checking or giving some feedback on any improvements that could be made, I would appreciate it. Thanks.
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File Type: zip TH Wire.zip (142.6 KB, 152 views)
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Old 1st June 2013, 08:08 PM   #2
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My amp is SE-SE,with two parallel BUF634's per channel,and on perfboard.Each line is thick,and covered with solder.Easily the same performance with 0.03 Ohm output resistance.
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Old 1st June 2013, 09:07 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTrenchev View Post
My amp is SE-SE,with two parallel BUF634's per channel,and on perfboard.Each line is thick,and covered with solder.Easily the same performance with 0.03 Ohm output resistance.
I've got one like that too...A LME49990 driving two parallel BUF634.
I did a board for mine. I have heat sinks on my BUF634s so it's not
very photogenic, all you see are the heat sinks...
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Old 1st June 2013, 09:39 PM   #4
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So, I had a look at the amp board.
You did the LME49990 and LME49600 in SMD
and everything else in PTH.
I'm not sure of the reasoning behind those choices...

The power traces are too small.
The left and right negative power rails are connected
by the thermal area. You put a thermal relief in your
thermal area...kind of defeats the purpose.

I didn't look at the power supply yet.

Last edited by Avro Arrow; 1st June 2013 at 09:39 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 2nd June 2013, 06:34 AM   #5
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Thanks for the input. I made the board that way due to having some LME49600's laying around and the LME49990's being SMD. I can do through-hole plating myself as well. I see your point, however. Kinda defeats the point.

I realized that I also happened to have a few DIP8 BUF634's in the parts bin as well, and that I could always just use the LME49990's on adapters, so I decided to make a single sided board. Needs a few jumpers, but otherwise all single sided. The ground does meander a bit, and I'm not sure if that's an issue or not. I could always add a ground plane to the top layer and some vias.

I made some changes to my original board for kicks, as well as another version halfway between the two just because all I had to do was click save after I changed the opamps.

Feel free to look at what I've attached and leave comments if you like. If not I'll probably just go with what I've got and stop posting my random cruft. ^_^

Thanks again for any help.
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File Type: zip TH Wire.zip (262.6 KB, 42 views)
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Old 2nd June 2013, 08:24 AM   #6
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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I dont see how this is 'the wire' at all, its bad enough publicly publishing a design that youve blatantly lifted the idea for and probably not asked permission or even informed Owen, but to just use the same name for a different design that has gone under no testing? I really dont know why you would do that? the layout is not worthy of the name IMO, traces crossing, no power or ground planes, no useful heatsink, vias all over the place, decoupling caps that are too far away, too physically large, on the end of a long trace with a via before the pin that will have very limited usefulness (OTT high quality decoupling and tight layout is what makes this amp shine), long feedback paths, traces that are too thin. huge long, thin traces from the main reservoir caps that are at the end of the board that has the lowest power demands and highest PSRR?

will all lme49990+lme49600 designs be called 'the wire' from now on? Owen designs very clean deliberately SMD for high performance and measures them to within an inch of their lives. I dont see that throwing a couple of the same parts onto a DIY PCB with no testing has anything to do with 'the wire'. and you are not the first to do this.
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Old 2nd June 2013, 08:29 AM   #7
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTrenchev View Post
My amp is SE-SE,with two parallel BUF634's per channel,and on perfboard.Each line is thick,and covered with solder.Easily the same performance with 0.03 Ohm output resistance.
and you know it has 'easily the same performance' how? sorry i'm not buying a perfboard amp having the same performance as a multilayer SMD amp when it comes to DC coupled wide bandwidth amps the parasitics are crucial. 'the wire' SE-SE is still the highest measured performance opc has ever measured on his AP APx585 and various other test gear, it tested his ability to get proper measurements.

its cool you like your amp, but making baseless throwaway statements like the above in reference to a design that was designed very objectively, with nothing to back them up... tweaks my ******** probe.


btw 0.02Ω is not even close to the same, let alone easily the same. the SE-SE is in the fractions of a miliohm. will that alone make a huge difference? no probably not; but its not the same by any means. also the SE-SE has a noise floor of -160 and -164dBV and here are the rest of the results starting here and filling the page

you have frequency response like this? thats 2 channels overlayed, so the channels match impeccably, not going to happen on perf. the bump at 80khz is the AP, not the amp ...
Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by qusp; 2nd June 2013 at 08:44 AM.
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Old 2nd June 2013, 08:30 AM   #8
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You're right. I didn't intend to take any credit for the design. I was just hoping for some design advice. I'd appreciate if an admin would remove my posts in this thread.
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Old 2nd June 2013, 10:54 AM   #9
qusp is offline qusp  Australia
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you can change the title yourself, the first post remains editable indefinitely to the OP, not sure about the subject but the content can.

its all good if you are asking for advice, no worries, but certainly speaking for myself you would get a more productive and less uptight response if you just present it as an amp you are playing with, mention being inspired by the wire' in the first post; whatever, but there is no need to call it 'the wire TH'.

Bare in mind Owen is making a go at making fully commercial amps too
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Old 2nd June 2013, 01:01 PM   #10
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@qusp

You know, it kind of a complement that people want to associate something they built
to "The Wire". I'm not saying it right or even acceptable, but how often have we asked
for an Asprin when were really know we are getting so other brand of pain killer.
How often has an amp been referred to as a CMoy evey though it was not even close
in design to what Chu Moy built? It might be inevitable that any op amp/IC buffer amp
gets referred to as "The Wire".

@Cyko500
Just find your own name for it and your fine. Just don't try and associate it with
"The Wire" or the "Ventus EZ" or the "Dragonfly V2" and probably others I don't know about...
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