Nothing won't be killed, The Wire should accept level from O2 without issue.
I just see no point doing so. O2 will be bottleneck here, degrading The Wire performance. You will only gain more power as The Wire is more powerful but O2 placed before will introduce unnecessary distortion. Anyway o2 is powerful enough to drive most phones. Just use The Wire alone without O2 if you want best performance. DC power supply in range like +/- 9-15V is recommended so 12V would fit perfectly.
Apologies - I'm working on it, however, I can't put off some of the work I'd like to do by BSing on other posts here and wasting others time. Figured it would be more appropriate to get to the point instead of beating around the bush.
The reason I'd like want this coming from the O2 is so that I get volume control without putting the potentiometer in the signal path. I'm on a bit of a budget and I also own the O2 already.
My requirement is really an amp with volume control and enough current to drive a set of Alpha Primes - The O2 is really good with reference grade output but doesn't have the current output to do the job.
If this would be an inefficient way to meet that design requirement - can anyone link me to a post/schematics to put gain control on The Wire? All I've read and seen so far entails sticking a Pot in the signal path and that seems like an irresponsible and bottle-necking addition in terms of performance.
Placing a potentiomteter before The Wire is perfectly fine. High quality 10k potentiometer or stepped attentuator is probably best choice for volume control in The Wire SE. Personally I've used Alps RK27 but heard good things about "DACT type 21 steps attenuator" which can be found on ebay. Just remember to change resistors on board according do your pot choice - http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vend...lable-bal-bal-se-se-lpuhp-52.html#post3824877
Other way is digital control in DAC. It may yeld even better results but unfortunatelly not every source offers that. Things gets more tricky in BAL-BAL. It is really difficult to find quad pot and it is crucial to keep resistor matched tight in balanced audio.
Other way is digital control in DAC. It may yeld even better results but unfortunatelly not every source offers that. Things gets more tricky in BAL-BAL. It is really difficult to find quad pot and it is crucial to keep resistor matched tight in balanced audio.
Hi Detectit1,
Your plan to use the O2 as a preamp would work just fine, but as others have mentioned, it will be the bottleneck in the system. Still, I understand the added effort of making a whole new headphone amp when you already have one, so if all you really need is more current output, then driving The Wire SE-SE from the output of an O2 will get you to where you need to be with minimal fuss.
If you're up for a bit more work, then certainly adding a pot to the input and a few connectors would probably net you better results than using the O2 as a preamp.
If you have a DAC with a built-in volume control, then that makes life a lot easier, and you can skip the preamp all together. This is really what The Wire series was designed for. If your DAC has balanced outputs, and you don't mind converting your headphones to 4-wire connectors, then the BAL-BAL is the best possible solution from an overall performance point of view.
Regards,
Owen
Your plan to use the O2 as a preamp would work just fine, but as others have mentioned, it will be the bottleneck in the system. Still, I understand the added effort of making a whole new headphone amp when you already have one, so if all you really need is more current output, then driving The Wire SE-SE from the output of an O2 will get you to where you need to be with minimal fuss.
If you're up for a bit more work, then certainly adding a pot to the input and a few connectors would probably net you better results than using the O2 as a preamp.
If you have a DAC with a built-in volume control, then that makes life a lot easier, and you can skip the preamp all together. This is really what The Wire series was designed for. If your DAC has balanced outputs, and you don't mind converting your headphones to 4-wire connectors, then the BAL-BAL is the best possible solution from an overall performance point of view.
Regards,
Owen
Thanks for the input Owen
My current DAC is the ODac - unless I can find something with better output without needing to overhaul my power supplies, etc, I think I'll be sticking to it for now.
If I'm looking to purchase The Wire SE-SE + PSU V2, which transformer should I pick up? Anything you'd suggest with fairly short lead times (available in the states instead of overseas)?
Lastly, if I go the PSU V2 route, can multiple of them be paralleled to give more current? I would probably run my Stax amp (252s) and this neat tube visualizer circuit off of it as well, and they'd require around 1.2A in total on a +12VDC rail.
My current DAC is the ODac - unless I can find something with better output without needing to overhaul my power supplies, etc, I think I'll be sticking to it for now.
If I'm looking to purchase The Wire SE-SE + PSU V2, which transformer should I pick up? Anything you'd suggest with fairly short lead times (available in the states instead of overseas)?
Lastly, if I go the PSU V2 route, can multiple of them be paralleled to give more current? I would probably run my Stax amp (252s) and this neat tube visualizer circuit off of it as well, and they'd require around 1.2A in total on a +12VDC rail.
Hey guys, I've been scrolling through this thread for a few days now. How does The Wire impedance match? Should I only expect optimal performance for a certain range of impedances? Or does is drive everything from sensitive IEM's to planar magnetics with the same quality?
Ps. If there's a component/value range for a given component that dictates this performance please include it if you can - just so I don't spam with a follow-up question
Ps. If there's a component/value range for a given component that dictates this performance please include it if you can - just so I don't spam with a follow-up question
Okay... That can mean two things... Or the amp is not adopted very much? And doesn't make up to its promises. Which I can't imagine. Don't see negatives...
Or its indeed abandoned...
Maybe Owen can shine a light on it.
The Wire should be fine with driving loads even as low as 4 ohms. LME49600 provides an adequate output current. High impedance headphones are no issue also, just keep supply voltage at like +/- 12V or higher to cover even 600 ohms headphones.
The Wire amplifiers range is indeed excellent, there are lots of happy builders there, including me. It lost popularity lately because looks like Owen don't have much time for DIY anymore and ordering PCBs from spreadsheets take some time to complete. Texas Instruments didn't help with making LME49990 and LME49610 end of life so stocking required chips is a bit harder too.
The Wire amplifiers range is indeed excellent, there are lots of happy builders there, including me. It lost popularity lately because looks like Owen don't have much time for DIY anymore and ordering PCBs from spreadsheets take some time to complete. Texas Instruments didn't help with making LME49990 and LME49610 end of life so stocking required chips is a bit harder too.
Yeah...I'll be glad when T.I. does the whole world a favor by discontinuing all of the "sterile" and "lifeless" sounding LME49xxx buffers.
These were a waste of money for me after listening to them with both the LME4990 and other single op-amps in front of them.
I find it simply hilarious how some people find this combination to sound so good.
This just goes to show that what sounds good to one person may sound like s_it to others.
Trying the LME4990 in other applications(within the feedback loop of other buffers and CF op-amps) also resulted in less-than-stellar SQ for me.
Glad T.I. pulled the plug on this worthless op-amp as well as there are many other single BJT and JFET op-amps that sound so much better from Analog, Linear and other manufactures.
Hopefully, ole' Owen will have some more boards produced for this wonderful sounding combo before T.I. pulls the plug for good on the National buffers.
Now...let's bust out the moonshine and soldering iron and build some "Wires"!
OK so basically what you are saying Ammel68. This Wire Amp isn't that good at all? Not very nice to say for the designer who has specifically chosen these parts.
For me why it appeal me the small form factor. So I can build this inside a dac.
My knowledge on buffers and or opamps doesn't go that far to determine if something is good or not.
For me why it appeal me the small form factor. So I can build this inside a dac.
My knowledge on buffers and or opamps doesn't go that far to determine if something is good or not.
ammel68 probably busted out a bit too much moonshine You know, I heard that is possible to lose sight by drinking poorly distilled liquors but looks like it is also possible to lose hearing As you can see in most of his posts he really doesn't like integrated circuits and measurements. Nothing wrong with it, not everyone must like accurate music reproduction. Sometimes distortion may be pleasant and seem to sound more natural (eg. tubes). Using an EQ or DSP may be a bit simpler and cheaper than building another amp tho
I had O2 and The Wire, now I'm using Richard Marsh Headphone amplifier which is fully discrete. Both are a great piece of gear, just a bit different. I don't see a point in pushing everywhere your opinion on the one proper way of building amplifiers. Every way is good if builder enjoy the final result - music. And I bet that those ICs won't sound "sterile" and "lifeless" as you say if you try some blind testing. I hope I didn't sound rude, those nuances in English are sometimes a bit tricky for me
You know, I heard that is possible to lose sight by drinking poorly distilled liquors but looks like it is also possible to lose hearing As you can see in most of his posts he really doesn't like integrated circuits and measurements. Nothing wrong with it, not everyone must like accurate music reproduction. Sometimes distortion may be pleasant and seem to sound more natural (eg. tubes). Using an EQ or DSP may be a bit simpler and cheaper than building another amp tho I had O2 and The Wire, now I'm using Richard Marsh Headphone amplifier which is fully discrete. Both are a great piece of gear, just a bit different. I don't see a point in pushing everywhere your opinion on the one proper way of building amplifiers. Every way is good if builder enjoy the final result - music. And I bet that those ICs won't sound "sterile" and "lifeless" as you say if you try some blind testing. I hope I didn't sound rude, those nuances in English are sometimes a bit tricky for me