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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
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Old 11th February 2018, 08:25 AM   #2641
miklos is offline miklos  Hungary
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Default "sterile" and "lifeless"

"Yeah...I'll be glad when T.I. does the whole world a favor by discontinuing all of the "sterile" and "lifeless" sounding LME49xxx buffers.
These were a waste of money for me after listening to them with both the LME4990 and other single op-amps in front of them.

I find it simply hilarious how some people find this combination to sound so good.
This just goes to show that what sounds good to one person may sound like s_it to others.

Trying the LME4990 in other applications(within the feedback loop of other buffers and CF op-amps) also resulted in less-than-stellar SQ for me.
Glad T.I. pulled the plug on this worthless op-amp as well as there are many other single BJT and JFET op-amps that sound so much better from Analog, Linear and other manufactures."

Yes, because you like harmonics and listen to harmonizer amps. The Ti is designed by professionals and it's a good clean amplifier, with exremly low distortion and it's sounding good to me. One only need good headphones and good source material. Here is some measurements to prove my point. The red trace is the source, yellow the amp. Load 33 Ohm s.
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Last edited by miklos; 11th February 2018 at 08:29 AM.
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Old 12th February 2018, 05:47 AM   #2642
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
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Originally Posted by BamboszeK View Post
ammel68 probably busted out a bit too much moonshine You know, I heard that is possible to lose sight by drinking poorly distilled liquors but looks like it is also possible to lose hearing As you can see in most of his posts he really doesn't like integrated circuits and measurements. Nothing wrong with it, not everyone must like accurate music reproduction. Sometimes distortion may be pleasant and seem to sound more natural (eg. tubes). Using an EQ or DSP may be a bit simpler and cheaper than building another amp tho
I had O2 and The Wire, now I'm using Richard Marsh Headphone amplifier which is fully discrete. Both are a great piece of gear, just a bit different. I don't see a point in pushing everywhere your opinion on the one proper way of building amplifiers. Every way is good if builder enjoy the final result - music. And I bet that those ICs won't sound "sterile" and "lifeless" as you say if you try some blind testing. I hope I didn't sound rude, those nuances in English are sometimes a bit tricky for me
LOL...

I've also built and listened to Mr. Marsh's HA, but only as preamp since I don't give a big ole' damn about headphones.
I have to admit it sounds a little better than this so called "Wire" nonsense, but still sucks moose balls compared to the Schiit Magni 3.
Sorry guys... but sometimes DIY just can NOT compete with affordable commercial designs like the Magni 3.
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Old 12th February 2018, 06:12 AM   #2643
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
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Originally Posted by miklos View Post
Yes, because you like harmonics and listen to harmonizer amps. The Ti is designed by professionals and it's a good clean amplifier, with exremly low distortion and it's sounding good to me. One only need good headphones and good source material. Here is some measurements to prove my point. The red trace is the source, yellow the amp. Load 33 Ohm s.
Sorry, I have no idea what in the hell "harmonizer amps" are. Do you even know what they are??

Listen...I could give a big ole' $_it less about measurements of the LME-series of buffers.
I've personally listened to them in numerous different applications(mostly line level or preamp) and their sterile SQ simply sucks horse balls.
If you think they sound good, then obviously you've "convinced" yourself that they "should" sound good based on their "low distortion" measurements.

Perhaps one day you'll and others will wake up and understand that measurements and sound quality do NOT go hand in hand.
Unfortunately, there are many members here who are under the misconception that "if it measures better than it must sound better".
Thank you for reinforcing that misconception.

Now...we must bust out the cinammon flavored moonshine and build some "Wires".

Good luck gentlemen.
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Old 12th February 2018, 07:02 AM   #2644
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
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Originally Posted by Detectit1 View Post
OK so basically what you are saying Ammel68. This Wire Amp isn't that good at all? Not very nice to say for the designer who has specifically chosen these parts.
Hmm..."basically" is a worthless filler term used far too often today and I'm sick of hearing people use it both on television and on the internet.

I personally don't care about the parts that the designer has chosen or whether you think my comments are "not very nice to say for the designer".

I'm not saying whether the so called "Wire" is good at all, or not. That is quite subjective.
I AM saying I've tried both of the ICs that it uses together, as in the "Wire" as well as in different applications, and have been less than impressed with their results.
There is simply nothing "magical" about either one of these National chips. Use them enough(assuming you can still purchase them) and you'll understand.

The combination of the LME49990 and the LME49610 may have been a "magical" combo WAY back in 2010, but today it's pretty much nothing or else Texas Instruments wouldn't be phasing out the ICs out for it. Go figure.

Now...we must bust out the peanut butter and grape moonshine and build some "Wires".
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Old 12th February 2018, 07:22 AM   #2645
miklos is offline miklos  Hungary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ammel68 View Post
Sorry, I have no idea what in the hell "harmonizer amps" are. Do you even know what they are??

Listen...I could give a big ole' $_it less about measurements of the LME-series of buffers.
I've personally listened to them in numerous different applications(mostly line level or preamp) and their sterile SQ simply sucks horse balls.
If you think they sound good, then obviously you've "convinced" yourself that they "should" sound good based on their "low distortion" measurements.

Perhaps one day you'll and others will wake up and understand that measurements and sound quality do NOT go hand in hand.
Unfortunately, there are many members here who are under the misconception that "if it measures better than it must sound better".
Thank you for reinforcing that misconception.

Now...we must bust out the cinammon flavored moonshine and build some "Wires".

Good luck gentlemen.
He, you must be a truckdriver.
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Old 12th February 2018, 08:09 AM   #2646
Detectit1 is offline Detectit1
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Whahaha Murica Am(m)eN68.

It really upsets you he .... Maybe it's better to get some Lays Chips.
Or wait... i guess they must be discontinued either... Tasteless..
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Old 12th February 2018, 10:42 PM   #2647
TypodCrow is offline TypodCrow
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Alright so from what I'm hearing in the past few comments, the LM chips in question are "too sterile" to be kept in existance? And we shouldn't be too sad that they're going out of production?

I haven't heard the amp myself just yet (in the middle of a buy), but I'm a strong believer of reference gear (Objective DAC -> Objective 2 -> ER4S is my daily work driver), and my understading was that The Wire was meant to be just that - a wire with gain. No subjective difference, no subjective improvements (similar to the Objective 2's principles, sans cost optimisations, DIY-friendly components, etc.).

I agree that there is almost always (note the three different flavors of emphasis on the almost) a difference between better measurements and better sound. However, my audiophiliac goals (and I'm sure the goals of some of the others who own/desire The Wire) are to find gear that is the most sterile and clean (what I would call benchmark, or reference grade) to support the entirety of my setup. Then, I can subjectively understand my tastes (in DAC's, amps, cans, maybe speakers some day) and relate them to the objective measurements of the individual components instead of some system as a whole.

Not everyone has/wants to do this; but there is definitely a niche for this "sterile" and "lifeless" gear...mostly in my audio stack (and sometimes in my pants when I'm really lonely).
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Old 13th February 2018, 01:01 AM   #2648
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
Quote:
Originally Posted by Detectit1 View Post
Whahaha Murica Am(m)eN68.

It really upsets you he .... Maybe it's better to get some Lays Chips.
Or wait... i guess they must be discontinued either... Tasteless..
What in the hell do "Lays Chips and i guess they must be discontinued either" have to do with anything in this thread or audio in general??
Since you obviously can't contribute anything technically to this thread or to my posts, you decide to post a reply about Lays Chips...SWEEET!

Tasteless?? You're SO funny!

Last edited by ammel68; 13th February 2018 at 01:05 AM. Reason: Spelling error.
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Old 13th February 2018, 01:12 AM   #2649
ammel68 is offline ammel68  United States
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
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Originally Posted by miklos View Post
He, you must be a truckdriver.
Apparently English and spelling aren't your strong points, either.

Just FYI, truck driver is TWO words, not one.

BUT...your reply above made me laugh just like this Detectit1 character's reply did!

Congratulations.
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Old 13th February 2018, 04:41 AM   #2650
opc is offline opc  Canada
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"The Wire" Ultra-High Performance Headphone Amplifier - PCB's
Hi Gentlemen,

Can you guys please drop this?

It would be great if an admin could clean up posts 2640 onward as they are off topic, include various members making rude comments to one another, and are generally unproductive.

ammel68:

You are always welcome to your opinion, but this is the third time you have posted essentially the same thing in this thread (see post 2581 and again at 2606), and it serves only to degrade the work that has been done here. If you are looking to pick a fight, please do so in a different thread, or feel free to start your own thread about all the various parts you dislike so passionately.

You've made it clear that you have not heard this specific amplifier, and that you do not care about headphones, so I'm not sure you have much to offer here.

Regards,
Owen
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