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Old 27th May 2008, 04:05 AM   #231
Salas is offline Salas  Greece
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Quote:
Originally posted by gedlee


I go between perfectly flat and about a 2 dB rise at maybe 50 Hz. Some rooms sound different than others, but in general I would say flat is best unless you have a notable lack of bass. If I can dig up my room response I will post it.

I believe, as many others have noted, that true CD sounds bright if EQ'd perfectly flat to 16 kHz. I drop this by a few dB at the top with the curtains that I use in front of the speakers and this seems to yield the best results. If you don't use curtains and you don't use a treble control and you use a flat EQ in the crossover, I guarantee you that you will find this bright as we are just not used to hearing wide coverage at 10 kHz.

Maybe you use a -2 db slide from 2k to 10k? That sounds good in general.
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Old 27th May 2008, 09:28 AM   #232
publius is offline publius  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ric Schultz
Earl,
Very interesting stuff. The DDS ENG 1-90 Pro waveguide is mentioned a lot for its good sound. Did you design it? Someone mentioned you did. What do you think of it? How low can it xover well? How does it compare with your waveguides? Thanks.
it loses directional control around 1.5k.

http://htguide.com/forum/showpost.ph...&postcount=274

From what people say, it performs okay, but is a little small for a nice cross to 15" or 12" woofer. Dr. G's will probably be better.
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Old 27th May 2008, 09:48 AM   #233
publius is offline publius  United States
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Dr. G.:

The off-axis plot at the bottom of these pages (which are amazing btw) show the ESP15 has a dip around 1.4khz that gets worse further off-axis and is not present on the ESP10 plot. What is causing that? Is it that the ESP15 could benefit from a slightly larger waveguide or is it something else?

http://www.ai-audio.com/products_esp15.html

http://www.ai-audio.com/products_esp10.html

Also, the off-axis plots on the ESP15 are flat from 1.2khz up, while on the ESP10, they are flat from about 2khz up. What effect does this have on how these two speakers sound?
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Old 27th May 2008, 11:52 AM   #234
AJinFLA is offline AJinFLA  United States
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Default Re: A visit with Earl Geddes - Review of Summa 15's

Quote:
Originally posted by nycavsr2000
Will better electronics make a better listening experience? Perhaps.

Anand.
Better..?? Better how?

cheers,

AJ
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Old 27th May 2008, 12:39 PM   #235
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by publius
Dr. G.:

The off-axis plot at the bottom of these pages (which are amazing btw) show the ESP15 has a dip around 1.4khz that gets worse further off-axis and is not present on the ESP10 plot. What is causing that? Is it that the ESP15 could benefit from a slightly larger waveguide or is it something else?

http://www.ai-audio.com/products_esp15.html

http://www.ai-audio.com/products_esp10.html

Also, the off-axis plots on the ESP15 are flat from 1.2khz up, while on the ESP10, they are flat from about 2khz up. What effect does this have on how these two speakers sound?
I described this before. The ideal waveguide would be more like 18" across. This would elliminate the midrange narrowing that you are talking about.

I seldom if ever make subjective comments. But having listened to the SUMMAs for five years now and comparing them to other speakers and the reviews of other listeners, I'd put those speakers up against any speaker at any price. I have had, at most an hour or two listening to the ESP10 and ESP12. They are more similar to the 15 than different, but they are not quite as "smooth" as the 15. This is reflected in the measurements. Bigger is better in speakers. You want that "ultimate sound" it takes a big speaker and a bit of money.
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Old 27th May 2008, 12:44 PM   #236
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by limono
Can't we just focus for now on DIY speaker kit which will be 10" with 80-100Hz bottom and options and leave the Summa or 12" 15" out of it? When the first batch will be delivered and when the first (beta??) testers are going to write or report on the sound?
Is there a prototype to listen too? I do like an idea of a curtain at a front of a speaker (it solves speaker finish problem too
Regards, L
I don't see any reason not to discuss the bigger speaker options.

I am casting the first waveguides this week. The first deleiveries could be next week.

I will probably havea pair here to audition by next week. But they won't have the advantage of the room that the Summas are in. I'm not giving up my SUMMAs!!

Oh, and for a name I'm going to use Nathan10, Abbey12 and Lidia15. Summas will always be the composite cabinet models. There maybe an Abbey plus, 1 12" woofer and 15" waveguide.
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Old 28th May 2008, 08:04 PM   #237
MEH is offline MEH  United States
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Default Change of plans?

Am I reading you correctly, Earl, that in addition to Nathan10 kits, you have now changed your plans and will definitely offer Abbey12 and Lidia15 kits? Or are these still just possibilities awaiting the success of the Nathan10 kits before becoming reality? If the larger waveguide kits are a definite go, do you have any estimate for when they will be available and at what initial price?
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Old 28th May 2008, 08:15 PM   #238
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Default Re: Change of plans?

Quote:
Originally posted by MEH
Am I reading you correctly, Earl, that in addition to Nathan10 kits, you have now changed your plans and will definitely offer Abbey12 and Lidia15 kits? Or are these still just possibilities awaiting the success of the Nathan10 kits before becoming reality? If the larger waveguide kits are a definite go, do you have any estimate for when they will be available and at what initial price?
I'd say based on response, the 12" is s deffinite go, I've already started on that one, but the Lidia15 is probably down for the count. No one has shown an interest in that size. There might be an Abbey_plus, a 12" woofer and 15" waveguide. There is a little interest in that, but not enough right now for me to commit to it.
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Old 28th May 2008, 08:46 PM   #239
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Default Re: Re: Change of plans?

Quote:
Originally posted by gedlee

I'd say based on response, the 12" is s deffinite go, I've already started on that one, but the Lidia15 is probably down for the count. No one has shown an interest in that size. There might be an Abbey_plus, a 12" woofer and 15" waveguide. There is a little interest in that, but not enough right now for me to commit to it.
I'm very much interested in the possibility of the Abbey_plus, enough to send in a deposit to get in the queue. Would you want the same $200 per unit as a deposit/earnest money? If not what will the number be? I suspect the final cost isn't known yet but at this point it's the seed number that matters.
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Old 28th May 2008, 09:53 PM   #240
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Default Re: Re: Re: Change of plans?

Quote:
Originally posted by mike galusha


I'm very much interested in the possibility of the Abbey_plus, enough to send in a deposit to get in the queue. Would you want the same $200 per unit as a deposit/earnest money? If not what will the number be? I suspect the final cost isn't known yet but at this point it's the seed number that matters.
I hate to take a deposit on this model as I'm not sure of if or when. Stay in touch though.
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