BIB: Pioneer with 4 piezo tweeters?

gychang · 13th March 2007, 03:15 PM

anyone built this? How is the sound? Would like any advice or input. I am planning on this since I bought the speakers.

http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-pioneer.asp

Specific questions.
1. all 4 piezo's needed?
2. what caps/resistors are needed or recommended.

thanks,

gychang

Cal Weldon · 13th March 2007, 03:39 PM

Consider buying one good tweeter vs. 4 piezos. Multiple tweeters are hard to integrate.

Scottmoose · 13th March 2007, 04:39 PM

No-one's built it to the best of my knowledge. One of Jeff's ideas this, based on some loose dims for the B20 I did a while back. He's away at the moment talking to Microsoft, but he'll be back at the weekend.

Kensai · 13th March 2007, 04:43 PM

Think Zilla was recommending .47uF caps over 8ohm resistors . . . you should really just need the 1 resistor per side.

Personally I don't think you'd need 4. Those orange squeezer models are rated at 94dB, and I have a hard time believing you'd need more than that to mate with the horn gain of the main unit. 2 would give 97dB, if needed, at which point I would want to put one front, one back to get a bit of dipole action at the top (take a look at Linkwitz's site; his new stuff is talking about putting a second tweeter on the back of his Orions).

Been working with my B20s in small OBs, nearfield, hinge mounted on my computer desk, I'm finding that I'm liking them true full range, no tweeters, though I don't like boosting anything on them via EQ (either introduces distortion of varying degrees or quickly runs through my available amplification; got an older one of those JVC Hybrid Feedback shelf systems rated for 30w/c into 4ohms, so if I'm lucky, I'm getting 20w/c into the B20s, though I doubt it). Been experimenting lately with cutting the middle out of the response with a series of parametric filters in my EQ. Its kinda like a BSC circuit except I've only got it running from maybe 125 through 6600 (its not flat, either, with a big null centered on 2200Hz which to my ears is the only audible problem area for the B20s, and only really 5-6dB).

Without actually touching the bass or treble signals, clarity, detail and air have been excellent. I know you had originally really liked your El Cheapo Pios in BiB, and the B20s are rated a bit higher on the top end than those, so you may not really be looking for much more up top. I've been thinking about those $5 Dayton domes, especially the smallest (5/8", I think) since it seems to rate the same sensitivity as the B20. Heck, it might even be small enough to be mounted coax on the B20.

Kensai

Nelson Pass · 13th March 2007, 06:19 PM

I agree, in fact you might have to pas the single piezos down
to 90 dB or so.

Kensai · 13th March 2007, 06:36 PM

For the purpose I've actually been looking at that 3"x7" Goldwood piezo. Its rated for 90dB and has greater top end extension (if specs are to be believed). You would also be able to control the dispersion to taste depending on how you orient the horn. Besides, the long rectangular horn is cooler looking than the square (though, maybe who cares since you want to put it on the back ;-p)

Looking forward to see you make sawdust on this one.

Kensai

gychang · 13th March 2007, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kensai

I've been thinking about those $5 Dayton domes, especially the smallest (5/8", I think) since it seems to rate the same sensitivity as the B20. Heck, it might even be small enough to be mounted coax on the B20.

Kensai

is this the one? http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=275-025

1. Will this work rear mounted with the Pioneer?
2. Will I need a simple crossover? (?partnumber at PE)

gychang

Scottmoose · 13th March 2007, 11:39 PM

Frankly, I reckon 4 is overkill as well -I can't think of a real need to have so many, but you could always add some should you feel short-changed. Strikes me BIB loaded B20 with helper piezo should be off the scale on the value for money chart. You like the idea Nelson?

gychang · 14th March 2007, 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Scottmoose
Frankly, I reckon 4 is overkill as well -I can't think of a real need to have so many, but you could always add some should you feel short-changed.

Trying a single rear mounted piezo seem reasonable?

gychang

blumenco · 14th March 2007, 03:00 AM

yeah, it is a nice driver. I was finding that a .68 in series with the piezo and a 10 ohm wirewound resistor ACROSS the terminals gave the best treeble the piezo was capable of to my ears and time to play with it. better could be had potentialy though.

also, perhaps a decent 4 dollar dome, etc would be a good choice too? there is one that parts express offers.

well, later dudes.

Clark

13th March 2007, 03:15 PM	#1
gychang diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Phoenix, Arizona	BIB: Pioneer with 4 piezo tweeters? anyone built this? How is the sound? Would like any advice or input. I am planning on this since I bought the speakers. http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-pioneer.asp Specific questions. 1. all 4 piezo's needed? 2. what caps/resistors are needed or recommended. thanks, gychang

13th March 2007, 03:39 PM	#2
Cal Weldon Speakerholic diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: British Columbia	Consider buying one good tweeter vs. 4 piezos. Multiple tweeters are hard to integrate. __________________ Next stop: Margaritaville Some of Cal's stuff \| Cal Weldon Consulting

14th March 2007, 03:00 AM	#10
blumenco diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Walla Walla	b20 yeah, it is a nice driver. I was finding that a .68 in series with the piezo and a 10 ohm wirewound resistor ACROSS the terminals gave the best treeble the piezo was capable of to my ears and time to play with it. better could be had potentialy though. also, perhaps a decent 4 dollar dome, etc would be a good choice too? there is one that parts express offers. well, later dudes. Clark

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13th March 2007, 04:39 PM	#3
Scottmoose diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK	No-one's built it to the best of my knowledge. One of Jeff's ideas this, based on some loose dims for the B20 I did a while back. He's away at the moment talking to Microsoft, but he'll be back at the weekend.

13th March 2007, 04:43 PM	#4
Kensai diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: St. Louis	Think Zilla was recommending .47uF caps over 8ohm resistors . . . you should really just need the 1 resistor per side. Personally I don't think you'd need 4. Those orange squeezer models are rated at 94dB, and I have a hard time believing you'd need more than that to mate with the horn gain of the main unit. 2 would give 97dB, if needed, at which point I would want to put one front, one back to get a bit of dipole action at the top (take a look at Linkwitz's site; his new stuff is talking about putting a second tweeter on the back of his Orions). Been working with my B20s in small OBs, nearfield, hinge mounted on my computer desk, I'm finding that I'm liking them true full range, no tweeters, though I don't like boosting anything on them via EQ (either introduces distortion of varying degrees or quickly runs through my available amplification; got an older one of those JVC Hybrid Feedback shelf systems rated for 30w/c into 4ohms, so if I'm lucky, I'm getting 20w/c into the B20s, though I doubt it). Been experimenting lately with cutting the middle out of the response with a series of parametric filters in my EQ. Its kinda like a BSC circuit except I've only got it running from maybe 125 through 6600 (its not flat, either, with a big null centered on 2200Hz which to my ears is the only audible problem area for the B20s, and only really 5-6dB). Without actually touching the bass or treble signals, clarity, detail and air have been excellent. I know you had originally really liked your El Cheapo Pios in BiB, and the B20s are rated a bit higher on the top end than those, so you may not really be looking for much more up top. I've been thinking about those $5 Dayton domes, especially the smallest (5/8", I think) since it seems to rate the same sensitivity as the B20. Heck, it might even be small enough to be mounted coax on the B20. Kensai

13th March 2007, 06:19 PM	#5
Nelson Pass The one and only Join Date: Mar 2001	I agree, in fact you might have to pas the single piezos down to 90 dB or so.

13th March 2007, 06:36 PM	#6
Kensai diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: St. Louis	For the purpose I've actually been looking at that 3"x7" Goldwood piezo. Its rated for 90dB and has greater top end extension (if specs are to be believed). You would also be able to control the dispersion to taste depending on how you orient the horn. Besides, the long rectangular horn is cooler looking than the square (though, maybe who cares since you want to put it on the back ;-p) Looking forward to see you make sawdust on this one. Kensai

13th March 2007, 11:39 PM	#8
Scottmoose diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK	Frankly, I reckon 4 is overkill as well -I can't think of a real need to have so many, but you could always add some should you feel short-changed. Strikes me BIB loaded B20 with helper piezo should be off the scale on the value for money chart. You like the idea Nelson?

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