Shouty FE167E in ML TQWT - diyAudio
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Old 26th January 2007, 07:31 PM   #1
ghisdal is offline ghisdal  Norway
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Default Shouty FE167E in ML TQWT

I have built the ML TQWT (folded version). After 100 hours I still find them a little shouty. Will this wear off, or will it stay this way?

I have damar and ModPodge. Can I use any of those two to calm down the driver?
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Old 26th January 2007, 09:02 PM   #2
holdent is offline holdent  Canada
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Did you add a BSC or build in a wide baffle? I suspect that this is the problem. The speakers will sound shouty because there is inadequate bass.
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Old 26th January 2007, 09:05 PM   #3
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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what type of amp are you using?

Depending on the cited sources, 100 hours is nowhere near enough time to full break in any of the Fostex FE series, particularly if the net sensitivity is high and your listening habits aren't at concert levels.

Remember that any cone treatment will be irreversible, so tread carefully, but starting with a light coat or 2 of damar on the whizzer cone might be a good start. I believe DaveD and others would advise to thin down either the damar or MP and apply a succession of thin coats.

The next big leap of faith would be phase plugs - I've heard them help in a lot of ways beyond just measurable smoothing in FR performance.

And of course as Holdent just posted above, and others as well will probably advise to try BSC - depending on proximity to rear wall, this may or not be necessary.

The wider "supra baffle" approach is my personal preference - even just a couple of layers of stiff cardboard taped to the front of the box was enough for me to detect an improvement on an early build of the Ron Clark A126 and Frugel-horn prototypes.

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Old 27th January 2007, 01:55 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisb

Depending on the cited sources, 100 hours is nowhere near enough time to full break in any of the Fostex FE series, particularly if the net sensitivity is high and your listening habits aren't at concert levels.

I have to disagree with this.

All of the 127/167/207's that I have had break in to 95% of their final sound in a very few hours. They reach a listenable condition in minutes. Even Lowther DX series are listenable in an hour or so. It may take a fair while to bring in all of the nuances at the top end, but this would take direct A/B testing with a well used driver.

Bottom end break in is 95% complete with one full cycle to Xsus. Running drivers hard for a long period of time does nothing to break it in. The way a lot of folks test new drivers is to take T/S parameters fresh out of the box, run them hard for X hours, then take T/S parameters again. They have changed. Then, sometime later, they take T/S parameters again and they change again back in the direction of the original readings. Well, yea, that happens. BTW, it really is good practice to run your driver at the power level you intend to use it at for a while, then take your readings immediately. Now your T/S parameters reflect how the driver will be used.

High end break in is primarily a matter of training your ears. The more different the sound of your new speakers from what they replace, the longer it will take for you to get used to the new sound. If you "forget" to use a proper contour (BSC) filter and do something about a rising frequency response, it will take a long, long time for the speakers to "break in".

How dare I say this? I build a fair number of speakers commercially. I build the cabinets, take new drivers out of the factory boxes and slap them in. I then let them play with normal (for me!) music for the few hours that it takes me to build up the shipping cartons and filler. The speakers now sound just the same as the speakers in my listening room that have thousands of hours on them.

YMMV, but....

Bob
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Old 27th January 2007, 02:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
High end break in is primarily a matter of training your ears. The more different the sound of your new speakers from what they replace, the longer it will take for you to get used to the new sound.
Could not agree more. After have been in what I call the "search of the Holy Hifi Graal" with several changes of speakers, it is a matter of getting used to existing speakers. By other words, ears breaking in.
And now I duck for the punches to come

Cheers!
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Old 27th January 2007, 02:42 PM   #6
MJK is offline MJK  United States
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I have had the exact same experiences as Bob describes above with my Fostex and Lowther speakers. If there are any changes in a driver's sound they should be extremely subtle in the high end over long periods of time. The bass output has not changed over time in my drivers, I confirmed this with both listening and T/S parameter measurements.
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Old 27th January 2007, 03:13 PM   #7
ghisdal is offline ghisdal  Norway
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What BSC would you recommend for this speaker? I have built the folded version which was meant for the 164 driver....
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Old 27th January 2007, 03:32 PM   #8
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This is what I use with all of my FE167E speakers with a 10 1/2" baffle width:

Click the image to open in full size.

Bob
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Old 27th January 2007, 03:37 PM   #9
ghisdal is offline ghisdal  Norway
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THANKS!

I'll give it a try and rapport back
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Old 29th January 2007, 04:55 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Brines
All of the 127/167/207's that I have had break in to 95% of their final sound in a very few hours.... High end break in is primarily a matter of training your ears.
My experiences with 2 sets of the same kind of speakers, in the same room, at the same time, with the same amps, one well broken in and one set fresh has me very much disagreeing with that statement.

Bob, are you still using the same amp you had last time i asked?

dave
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