Comparing Ciare CH250 with Supravox bicones - diyAudio
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Old 6th December 2005, 08:58 PM   #1
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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Default Comparing Ciare CH250 with Supravox bicones

Hi folks,

For the past year I have been using Ciare CH250 speakers in a test baffle. Since two months I had a nice pair of Supravox HP215RFT Signature Bicone waiting to be placed in a baffle. I wait for some nice wood to arrive, so I decided to mount the drivers in my old and ugly test baffle (the drivers on the downside in the picture). I have now listened to the Supravoxes for two days and I must say I am very much impressed!!!

First I have to make some reservations:
- The Supravoxes are not broken in properly (just 15 hours of playing)
- I use different speakers cables for the bicones (1 or 1.5 m CAT5 instead of 2m OTA)
- The bicones are low to the ground. This improves baffle stiffness and bass. Also, the HF content is less at ear height this way.
- I compared the drivers without any EQ. With EQ the differences could be different.

I plan to rotate the baffle 180 degrees later to put the supravoxes on top.

This is just a first test because I just couldn't wait for my new baffles to arrive!

Well... now my observations for the Supravox drivers:
- Definitely more and deeper BASS! That's is very good because the Ciares were a bit too thin without EQ. I hope the reason for the improved bass is the lower resonance frequency of the driver and not the lower position. I will find that out later!
- More relaxed. A more balanced sound.
- More detail.
- Better focus.
- Better instrument realism.

I need to listen to them for a longer time to get a good opinion, but for this moment I am very satisfied!!!

Hopefully I can finish the new baffles before the end of the year, or in the first month of the next year. I ordered some nice birch plywood, hopefully the sound get even better than! (at least the look will be better don't you think?)

To be continued...
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Old 7th December 2005, 02:07 PM   #2
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Nice post, thanks for sharing. One would hope that with the cost difference, the Supravox would be much nicer. Keep us posted on how things go.
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Old 7th December 2005, 05:27 PM   #3
Nuuk is offline Nuuk  United Kingdom
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Hi Fedde, for me the Ciares were a little bit on the 'thin' side and that's why I have gone back to my Goodmans 201's!

You may care to try Ron Clark's recommendation of putting a 50 ohm resistor in parallel with each driver!
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Old 7th December 2005, 07:18 PM   #4
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally posted by one1speed
Nice post, thanks for sharing. One would hope that with the cost difference, the Supravox would be much nicer. Keep us posted on how things go.
You're right... the Supravox is 5 times more expensive!

But still very much worth the money I'd say. For under 750 euro you can make a very nice pair of open-baffle speakers with these drivers. And I guess it will beat many *much* higher priced speakers!!!

I 'll keep you all informed. Actually, you can expect a webpage when the project is finished...

The Ciares still can sound very fine, especially with some EQ. I was able to listen to them for a year and they kept on sounding better. But these Supravoxes are of a different class!

Fedde
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Old 6th January 2006, 08:48 PM   #5
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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So... this week I had some more holiday. Thus some time to experiment again. Finally, I turned the baffles upside. This resulted in Supravoxes at ear height. Wow!!! The sound was very surprising, much more open then I'd have guessed they would be when they were below! The bass is a bit less, but also tighter. But the mids and highs are so much faster and detailed! After comparing one Supravox driver with a Ciare (both at ear height) I concluded that the supravoxes are much faster speakers. This is likely due to the much lower mass of the cone and due to stronger magnets.

The amount of detail of the stereo Supravox open-baffle system is breath-taking. Hi-hats and rides sound much more accurate, piano sounds better than ever and voices are very easy to follow without sounding too harsh or digital. Many details in the music (small percussion sounds, vibes, instrument noises etc.) become apparant without becoming irritating. Sometimes I was actually startled with a few tunes. (for example with Gidon Kremer - El Sol Sueno. I won't spoil the surprise, get the song and put the volume high!)
The soundstage is quite deep. And live recordings sound really cool! You get almost the feeling of being there.... nice stuff these Supravoxes...

Fedde

ps. Sorry for the rave review, good mood today
ps2. I could use a sub for some extra 20-40 Hz bass... hm...
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Old 9th January 2006, 07:53 PM   #6
kepa1 is offline kepa1  France
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I'm not surprised either fedde, these speakers won a test in an OB competition for a French Mag, over Phy HP and the F200A. I wonder if they need a tweeter too, or maybe "bicone" means coaxial?

And notice the article states 190 / unit.

Anyway, I wish you a lot of listening pleasure

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Old 9th January 2006, 08:22 PM   #7
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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Thanks for your comments Kepa1!

Actually there are four similar products from Supravox:

- HP215 RFT64 (e 160,-)
- HP215 RFT64 bicone (e 190,-)
- HP215 Signature (e 230,-)
- HP215 Sign. bicone (e 255,-)

The prices are from Spectrumaudio.de, but they don't seem to sell it anymore. The prices are old too, prices are higher now.

I have the HP215 Signature Bicone. Bicone means they have a small whizzer cone for highs, thus these speakers go to 19 kHz instead of 10 kHz. The whizzer cone moves with the same coil as the rest of the cone but is better in HF movement. The Signature Bicone speakers go a bit lower and have a more even response compared to the RTF64 bicones.

I think they have sufficient high frequencies for me, but the HF content is quite directional. This is not a big problem for me (actually it has advantages when you are sitting at the sweet spot!)

Still enjoying them greatly...

Greetings,

Fedde
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Old 9th January 2006, 08:36 PM   #8
kepa1 is offline kepa1  France
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Quote:
Originally posted by fedde
Actually there are four similar products from Supravox:

- HP215 RFT64 (e 160,-)
- HP215 RFT64 bicone (e 190,-)
- HP215 Signature (e 230,-)
- HP215 Sign. bicone (e 255,-)
...
I have the HP215 Signature Bicone.
So, you have the top of the line... Congratulations and thanks for the explanations too

Alain
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Old 9th January 2006, 08:39 PM   #9
kepa1 is offline kepa1  France
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No, you don't because here is their top top top 8":
(EXC2000 series)
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Old 9th January 2006, 09:20 PM   #10
fedde is offline fedde  Netherlands
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True, that should be a killer speaker! BTW: by no means I was trying to brag...

And yes, the signature bicones are not so cheap. But for the 750 euro you can't buy really good speakers in a shop can you...? And the wood work is well... virtually nothing.

Ciao,

Fedde
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