RtV
The one truly studied and proven load is the Fostex FE168Sigma. You would be guaranteed success. It is a great driver for this. I have a pair in the living room, and am continually impressed. For the investment of a few extra $, this is a great great BIB.
Lovechild
Imagine that box with a Hemp 8 sporting big Xmax and powered by XBL^2 Adire motor. This would be the Reference BIB, in my opinion. Great graphic and benchmark for scale. Thanks to Jeff for the website addition for longer term reference. These things are real winners, and I will be trying the Hemp 8 big bopper when Adire/Hemp Acoustics release the new driver.
The one truly studied and proven load is the Fostex FE168Sigma. You would be guaranteed success. It is a great driver for this. I have a pair in the living room, and am continually impressed. For the investment of a few extra $, this is a great great BIB.
Lovechild
Imagine that box with a Hemp 8 sporting big Xmax and powered by XBL^2 Adire motor. This would be the Reference BIB, in my opinion. Great graphic and benchmark for scale. Thanks to Jeff for the website addition for longer term reference. These things are real winners, and I will be trying the Hemp 8 big bopper when Adire/Hemp Acoustics release the new driver.
Hi
Godzilla, I do not remeber what exact dims - I guess they didn't exist then - I took something like 6 ft tall and a footprint of 10" x 20" external.
Yes indead Randy, this is Le Corbusier's six-foot tall Englishman waving at you. If you see LC's early urban designs and you will understand why his Englishman is a good partner for "Bigger Is Better".
@dmason
Hempster XBL^2 - Right on! - The Dodge Challenger of Fullrange Drivers...
One concern though, my tiny FR125S XBL^2, when powered close to Xmax, really has some problems with detail in the upper mid and high range - but let's not talk it down before it's even here!
best, LC
Godzilla, I do not remeber what exact dims - I guess they didn't exist then - I took something like 6 ft tall and a footprint of 10" x 20" external.
Yes indead Randy, this is Le Corbusier's six-foot tall Englishman waving at you. If you see LC's early urban designs and you will understand why his Englishman is a good partner for "Bigger Is Better".
@dmason
Hempster XBL^2 - Right on! - The Dodge Challenger of Fullrange Drivers...
One concern though, my tiny FR125S XBL^2, when powered close to Xmax, really has some problems with detail in the upper mid and high range - but let's not talk it down before it's even here!
best, LC
I am getting ready to put my box together as soon as Dims are finalized. It looks like the cabinet for my driver is not going to be quite as tall as I would like. I was wondering if I could make an aesthetic change to the top of the cabinet as pictured with relative impunity or would it be a big enough difference to have to rework the dimensions.
Attachments
No, go right ahead. It'll increase the mouth size a bit, not likely to go so far as to cause any problems. Might even bring a few benefits.
Lovechild -which Dodge Challenger? I like the 440/RT over the Hemi's myself, but I suspect I'm in the minority...
Dan -I look forward to the new drivers with great anticipation. Nice combination that -hempsters with those demon motors.
Cheers
Scott
Lovechild -which Dodge Challenger? I like the 440/RT over the Hemi's myself, but I suspect I'm in the minority...
Dan -I look forward to the new drivers with great anticipation. Nice combination that -hempsters with those demon motors.
Cheers
Scott
Lovechild/Scott
If the Adire/Hemp is the 440, then with shaved heads, teflon, the works. The Hemi? Or BMW M-Coupe w Schnitzer/AMG full-load for you and yours, L.C...
D.W. has been sniffin' the wind, acknowledging what The People Want, and the fact that the current V 1. Hemps don't exactly suck either,...and I would bet that this is EXACTLY what is coming. (see other thread)
If the Adire/Hemp is the 440, then with shaved heads, teflon, the works. The Hemi? Or BMW M-Coupe w Schnitzer/AMG full-load for you and yours, L.C...
D.W. has been sniffin' the wind, acknowledging what The People Want, and the fact that the current V 1. Hemps don't exactly suck either,...and I would bet that this is EXACTLY what is coming. (see other thread)
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bibjf.asp
is this better?
I would create hyperlinks from the driver manuf. logos...
Peace,
Godzilla
is this better?
I would create hyperlinks from the driver manuf. logos...
Peace,
Godzilla
Greets!
440 R/T, eh? That brings back the memories! I use to run around with a dude high up in the Chrysler hierarchy that got custom cars as part of his perks package and in '70 had them stuff a tweaked 440 six pack under the hood of a fully loaded Chrysler 300 convertible with four wheel disc brakes, braced frame, special suspension, etc., more suited to running the 24 hrs Du Mans than cruising for chicks, though with its Candy Apple Red paint, white on white leather interior and a four channel stereo system I cobbled together, it was no slouch in that department either
: http://www.chrysler300site.com/cgibin/history.cgi?1970
It was a blast to drive and one Sunday we traveled from Atlanta to Shreveport, had a leisurely late lunch with some friends that had just moved there and was back home by 9 pm. Around 145 mph it had enough air under it that steering corrections were pretty much non-existant, so a bigger 'chin' spoiler was a high priority Monday morning.
We easily bested that average going to Dallas for the '84 F1 race in a Jim Downing tweaked '80 RX-7, but that's a story for another time........
Ah, to be young and foolish again!
GM
440 R/T, eh? That brings back the memories! I use to run around with a dude high up in the Chrysler hierarchy that got custom cars as part of his perks package and in '70 had them stuff a tweaked 440 six pack under the hood of a fully loaded Chrysler 300 convertible with four wheel disc brakes, braced frame, special suspension, etc., more suited to running the 24 hrs Du Mans than cruising for chicks, though with its Candy Apple Red paint, white on white leather interior and a four channel stereo system I cobbled together, it was no slouch in that department either
: http://www.chrysler300site.com/cgibin/history.cgi?1970It was a blast to drive and one Sunday we traveled from Atlanta to Shreveport, had a leisurely late lunch with some friends that had just moved there and was back home by 9 pm. Around 145 mph it had enough air under it that steering corrections were pretty much non-existant, so a bigger 'chin' spoiler was a high priority Monday morning.
We easily bested that average going to Dallas for the '84 F1 race in a Jim Downing tweaked '80 RX-7, but that's a story for another time........
Ah, to be young and foolish again!
GM
lovechild said:
Greets, part deux!
Have no fear, DW and company's products are proof positive that they're up to the task and on the same WL, so to speak, but just as with other future products he's asked input on, he has to choose what hopefully will be the most profitable. What was President Nixon's Q WRT policy making? "But will it play in Peoria?"
GM
Greets!
Yeah, if I had my way though, it would be a modern day replica of W.E.'s field coil 12" that was good from 50-12 kHz, which allows you to dial in your Q of choice, from a compression horn's ~0.1 to as high as you want to go. With today's materials technology, it could probably be pushed even higher/lower, though inexpensive and small cab would not be part of its specs. You could buy a nice used car for what W.E. charged for it in '32, which in today's world would make Lowther's pricing bargain basement specials, relatively speaking, and minimum cab Vb for solid midbass/45 Hz Fb was 9 ft^3.
Then there's W.E.'s field coil 18" OB sub driver with a motor so massive it had chain hoist/grab handles welded on with a cast base to stage floor mount it.
Those were the days! Without bean counters to suppress design/manufacturing and Bell Lab's 'deep pockets', the engineers/artisans had free rein to make performance the only goal.
Oh well, I can dream........
GM
Yeah, if I had my way though, it would be a modern day replica of W.E.'s field coil 12" that was good from 50-12 kHz, which allows you to dial in your Q of choice, from a compression horn's ~0.1 to as high as you want to go.
With today's materials technology, it could probably be pushed even higher/lower, though inexpensive and small cab would not be part of its specs. You could buy a nice used car for what W.E. charged for it in '32, which in today's world would make Lowther's pricing bargain basement specials, relatively speaking, and minimum cab Vb for solid midbass/45 Hz Fb was 9 ft^3.Then there's W.E.'s field coil 18" OB sub driver with a motor so massive it had chain hoist/grab handles welded on with a cast base to stage floor mount it.
Those were the days! Without bean counters to suppress design/manufacturing and Bell Lab's 'deep pockets', the engineers/artisans had free rein to make performance the only goal.
Oh well, I can dream........
GM
Any comments on the BIB website?
I have emailed Martin King to ask him for his support in continuing to build the site. It is his software that’s generating the dims and sims. I felt it was his right to allow me to continue or not.
I would do whatever needed to continue building the site for the speaker builder community but would hate to see commercial builders take advantage of this information.
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bibjf.asp
Peace,
Godzilla
I have emailed Martin King to ask him for his support in continuing to build the site. It is his software that’s generating the dims and sims. I felt it was his right to allow me to continue or not.
I would do whatever needed to continue building the site for the speaker builder community but would hate to see commercial builders take advantage of this information.
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bibjf.asp
Peace,
Godzilla
Good work Godzilla. You are a credit to the diy community. Some suggestions/comments:
1) Some background on the BiB and, if possible, a reference to the original Nagaoka design and Cain's write-up.
2) Comments by GM and Cain (and of course Moose and Mason). I think the two of them nail the heart of what the design is all about: experimentation and results that defy sims. (Heck, I've stuck in most all drivers that I own and tune by moving the BiBs to and fro from the corners.) GM's comments about swamping vas, sd, qts and fs are precious.
3) Suggestions for variations on BiB, like flipping it so the mouth exits the floor (I think GM recommended this for one of the drivers) and using them for bass towers.
4) A gallery section with some user comments would be the coup de grace'
Thanks
1) Some background on the BiB and, if possible, a reference to the original Nagaoka design and Cain's write-up.
2) Comments by GM and Cain (and of course Moose and Mason). I think the two of them nail the heart of what the design is all about: experimentation and results that defy sims. (Heck, I've stuck in most all drivers that I own and tune by moving the BiBs to and fro from the corners.) GM's comments about swamping vas, sd, qts and fs are precious.
3) Suggestions for variations on BiB, like flipping it so the mouth exits the floor (I think GM recommended this for one of the drivers) and using them for bass towers.
4) A gallery section with some user comments would be the coup de grace'
Thanks
tone
yeah...the bass and tone i am getting out of the fx 120s is simply unreal. everyone who has heard them could have sworn that i was cheating with a subwoofer of some type. i have found that with my shorter pair and higher ceiling height that it helps alot to vary how much they are lifted off the floor. I am currently set on about a foot of lift. i will imagine the 166 esr/168ez version i will build shortly being 64 inches or so to not have as much of an issue with this. of course, while the quantity of bass is huge from the fx 120s, the speed is not quite there. of course, i am splitting hairs here. however, i feel that lower qts would help this immensely. i have a pair of fe 108 esIIs i will try in these cabinets. they should just fit in the hole...
i have found the magnet wire trick to be essential with these drivers as well. it profoundly limits the excursion (and audibly lowers qts to some degree?) versus 16 gauge lamp cord for instance. again, the amp used is ppel84.
thanks so much everyone for making this information public domain and open source.
one of my favourite quotes is
"it is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who takes the credit" - harry truman.
diyers, especially the beginners into full range will really have alot of fun with this project i feel. it is highly rewarding for the effort put in.
clark
yeah...the bass and tone i am getting out of the fx 120s is simply unreal. everyone who has heard them could have sworn that i was cheating with a subwoofer of some type. i have found that with my shorter pair and higher ceiling height that it helps alot to vary how much they are lifted off the floor. I am currently set on about a foot of lift. i will imagine the 166 esr/168ez version i will build shortly being 64 inches or so to not have as much of an issue with this. of course, while the quantity of bass is huge from the fx 120s, the speed is not quite there. of course, i am splitting hairs here. however, i feel that lower qts would help this immensely. i have a pair of fe 108 esIIs i will try in these cabinets. they should just fit in the hole...
i have found the magnet wire trick to be essential with these drivers as well. it profoundly limits the excursion (and audibly lowers qts to some degree?) versus 16 gauge lamp cord for instance. again, the amp used is ppel84.
thanks so much everyone for making this information public domain and open source.
one of my favourite quotes is
"it is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who takes the credit" - harry truman.
diyers, especially the beginners into full range will really have alot of fun with this project i feel. it is highly rewarding for the effort put in.
clark
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib.asp
New modifications... i added the Pioneer B20 dims and the Vistaton logo for the B200 dims and sims to come.... and some other buttons.
Anyone want to submit any contributions to the site let me know.
godzilla3@hotmail.com
Peace.
New modifications... i added the Pioneer B20 dims and the Vistaton logo for the B200 dims and sims to come.... and some other buttons.
Anyone want to submit any contributions to the site let me know.
godzilla3@hotmail.com
Peace.