I'm looking for advise on a single full range driver for a speaker going up against the wall. I currently have Tang-Bang W3-871s which has acceptable bass to 80db and rolls off down to about 50. Cabinet is 5 1/2" x 7" x 7".
I'd like a driver to go flat to 50Hz without some mid-bass hump at 100hz.
A 4'" driver with Xmax of 3mm (vs .5mm for the 871) seems a good choice. Problem is, most 4" roll off above 13K.
The Jordan JX92S has too much bass and treble looks a little rough. The smaller JX53 is smoother in the HF but is a 3" driver like I already have, albeit with a 3mm Xmax. Besides I am worried about harshness of a metal driver with a digital amp.
Fostex is an option but most have very low Xmax and the FE 108EZ or FX 120 have Q's of 8! Wow that's high.
Tang-Band has a W4-1320 bamboo driver but still not available.
I don't want any x-over or baffle step correction to muck up the signal path. Cabinet size would be 6" x 8 1/2' x 7".
Any suggestions for a driver and vented or sealed cabinet design would be grealty appreciated.
I'd like a driver to go flat to 50Hz without some mid-bass hump at 100hz.
A 4'" driver with Xmax of 3mm (vs .5mm for the 871) seems a good choice. Problem is, most 4" roll off above 13K.
The Jordan JX92S has too much bass and treble looks a little rough. The smaller JX53 is smoother in the HF but is a 3" driver like I already have, albeit with a 3mm Xmax. Besides I am worried about harshness of a metal driver with a digital amp.
Fostex is an option but most have very low Xmax and the FE 108EZ or FX 120 have Q's of 8! Wow that's high.
Tang-Band has a W4-1320 bamboo driver but still not available.
I don't want any x-over or baffle step correction to muck up the signal path. Cabinet size would be 6" x 8 1/2' x 7".
Any suggestions for a driver and vented or sealed cabinet design would be grealty appreciated.
I think the Adire FR125S sounds like what you're looking for, but I'm not sure if it's available yet. Also, I'm not sure if you can find and specs or response graphs on it yet either. Timn8ter amongst others, knows a lot more about it than I do. This is just what I vaguely recall. If I remember correctly, I think it's supposed to compete with the Jordan for about half the price, so maybe that'll give you some idea of it's capabilities. Might want to google it though.
I've been given a pair for testing. The FR125 looks to be very competitive with the Jordan. Bass response is similar to the WR125S which means you can put it very close to a wall and get nice sound. The big difference is an improved voice coil and a slightly different cone treatment. Additionally the surround material extends just a hair more onto the cone which gives it smoother reponse and helps cone control in the upper range. The FR125 should be available for purchase in about 3 weeks. I've heard the WR125S in a 9 liter cabinet with a 1.5D port which provides nice bass response without a bump in the upper bass region. I expect the FR125 would do the same. I'll post more info as testing proceeds. Keep an eye out for Planet10. He's got some good stuff coming for this driver.
Thanks for the info. I emailed Adire and they thought the FR-125 would be a good choice. I got the frequency response at www.creativesound.ca. There is a 5dB boost in the bass between 100-200 Hz which I am a little concerned about.
Parts Express will be selling the Tang-Band W4-1320 SB. This 4" bamboo driver looks flatter through the bass and a moving mass of about 1/2 the Adire unit. No is .501% vs. .2??%. Qms is 1.3. Xmax 3mm. The response curve is maybe a little better up to 13kHz then a dip and 8 dB peak (resonance?) from 15-20Khz. Price is $34 each.
The driver is made from bamboo and I am a little concerned about bamboo coloring the sound as I like paper cones so far. Although I've heard Audio Note uses wood drivers and they are quite popular.
Stilll considering the JX-53 as the 3mm vs. .5 mm Xmax may give the bass I need. This is the *smoothest* 3" driver I have ever seen from 10-20K. And the waterfall plot shows total damping in 1.5 ms. Should be very clean with excellent prat within it's SPL rating I'm guessing.
I'l search here for more info on the Jordan.
Parts Express will be selling the Tang-Band W4-1320 SB. This 4" bamboo driver looks flatter through the bass and a moving mass of about 1/2 the Adire unit. No is .501% vs. .2??%. Qms is 1.3. Xmax 3mm. The response curve is maybe a little better up to 13kHz then a dip and 8 dB peak (resonance?) from 15-20Khz. Price is $34 each.
The driver is made from bamboo and I am a little concerned about bamboo coloring the sound as I like paper cones so far. Although I've heard Audio Note uses wood drivers and they are quite popular.
Stilll considering the JX-53 as the 3mm vs. .5 mm Xmax may give the bass I need. This is the *smoothest* 3" driver I have ever seen from 10-20K. And the waterfall plot shows total damping in 1.5 ms. Should be very clean with excellent prat within it's SPL rating I'm guessing.
I'l search here for more info on the Jordan.
Take note that the response testing of the FR125 was performed in a 7 liter box. That will cause a bump. Dan's going to test it in a IES baffle so the results should be a little clearer. Also, if you're going to place the enclosure near a wall you will not want the bass response to be equal to the mids in open space.
Hi chuck55,
There are several posts on the wall mounted spiral horn. I have never heard this speaker, but it looks interesting for a wall design.
http://www.cornu.de/flat1.html
There are several posts on the wall mounted spiral horn. I have never heard this speaker, but it looks interesting for a wall design.
http://www.cornu.de/flat1.html
Attachments
Timn8ter, look forward to seeing the response on a baffle.
Linesource, that is an interesting design, don't think it will fit on my mantle though.
Audiobomber, 2"? I was not aware of that! Well I guess that driver is not realistic for a single driver speaker.
I've got a local woodworker who will make the cabinets, all 45 degreee mitres, glued and screwed together for $100. The front panel will be replaceable so I can change drivers in the future. I'm thinking of holding it on with through rods a.k.a. Epos ES12.
Does anyone know what NSM uses (www.nsmaudio.com/brochures/5sbroc.html)? They have a carbon fiber driver for their cheaper model 5. The upgraded$495 Model 5S has a "new paper cone high excursion woofer". Sounds like the Adire unit abeilt, not a full range design. But interesting that paper is considered superior to carbon fiber. Alon, (now Nola) also uses paper drivers and they are very highly regarded.
Linesource, that is an interesting design, don't think it will fit on my mantle though.
Audiobomber, 2"? I was not aware of that! Well I guess that driver is not realistic for a single driver speaker.
I've got a local woodworker who will make the cabinets, all 45 degreee mitres, glued and screwed together for $100. The front panel will be replaceable so I can change drivers in the future. I'm thinking of holding it on with through rods a.k.a. Epos ES12.
Does anyone know what NSM uses (www.nsmaudio.com/brochures/5sbroc.html)? They have a carbon fiber driver for their cheaper model 5. The upgraded$495 Model 5S has a "new paper cone high excursion woofer". Sounds like the Adire unit abeilt, not a full range design. But interesting that paper is considered superior to carbon fiber. Alon, (now Nola) also uses paper drivers and they are very highly regarded.
A driver has to mate with a box (considering we are talking about small box fullragen drivers here).
if the box is small and you got a hump an aperiodic port can help. what i really does i make the box more lossy.
small drivers like th JX53, ff85K etc. prefer to be XO at 300hz+ (and really shine when XOed at 500Hz+).
5" drivers would offer more bass albeit at the expense of more beaming and rolled of hf that is why some have mated the JX92 with super tweeters above 6k (the GS2 and EB Cantare).
so it may seem that a good 3-4" driver would be the most balanced. Fostex drivers tend to perfrom better than the specs would have you believe and since many of them are designed for horn loading they might be sutiable for near wall placement. However their tonal quality is an acquired taste and for general purpose audio/Ht/av use i have been recommended the JX92 and (very recently) the FR125 over the FX120.
unfortunately Adire or Jordan dont make a 4" (like the FOstex 108 or 103) I suspect if they do it might be the fullrange speaker for most of our needs esp. for those who are thinking of a 1.5 way (like the ELF 1.5).
if the box is small and you got a hump an aperiodic port can help. what i really does i make the box more lossy.
small drivers like th JX53, ff85K etc. prefer to be XO at 300hz+ (and really shine when XOed at 500Hz+).
5" drivers would offer more bass albeit at the expense of more beaming and rolled of hf that is why some have mated the JX92 with super tweeters above 6k (the GS2 and EB Cantare).
so it may seem that a good 3-4" driver would be the most balanced. Fostex drivers tend to perfrom better than the specs would have you believe and since many of them are designed for horn loading they might be sutiable for near wall placement. However their tonal quality is an acquired taste and for general purpose audio/Ht/av use i have been recommended the JX92 and (very recently) the FR125 over the FX120.
unfortunately Adire or Jordan dont make a 4" (like the FOstex 108 or 103) I suspect if they do it might be the fullrange speaker for most of our needs esp. for those who are thinking of a 1.5 way (like the ELF 1.5).
Just to let you all in a little info.
The FR125S,WR125S,WR125ST are designed by (Dan) ADIRE but are a Creative Sound driver.Belongs to CSS.
Dan just designed the driver for Bob at CSS.
Just had to let you know as a lot of people are asking why Adire does not have them listed.
Al
The FR125S,WR125S,WR125ST are designed by (Dan) ADIRE but are a Creative Sound driver.Belongs to CSS.
Dan just designed the driver for Bob at CSS.
Just had to let you know as a lot of people are asking why Adire does not have them listed.
Al
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
NAvin.
Been around a little just really loaded
The photo speakers uses the WR not the FR I will not use the FR in a 2 or 3 way as really like the open,detail the ribbon just brings out.
The WR and FR look 100% the same no one will tell the difference.
The FR will sure give the X92S a run for its money no issue there at all.
The X92S I have in the cabinets ported tuned to 55hz and the low end is the only thing the Jordan has over the WR or FR drivers.
Beside from the clear mids on both the WR and FR no contest with the Jordans here and highs out of the WR just stun people who listen to my demo cabinets which are twin post cabinet a set to run the WR fullrange and another that runs the WR and the tweeter along with a network(RAW 1).Well I can never stop watching peoples face time and time agin (just today as a fact for a few more demos) on when people listen to them and then I ask how they sound and then listen to comments 95% say they sound great a small margin say well a little up balanced in the top end.
Well I can hook up the tweeters if you wish!!
NO WAY I here this over and over demo after demo.
Till they get up and put a ear to the tweeter do they all believe that is possible.
And that is just the WR the best I can describe it.
The FR even better!
As for designs.
I will say a wall design is coming fullrange in a few models SOON!
Al
Been around a little just really loaded
The photo speakers uses the WR not the FR I will not use the FR in a 2 or 3 way as really like the open,detail the ribbon just brings out.
The WR and FR look 100% the same no one will tell the difference.
The FR will sure give the X92S a run for its money no issue there at all.
The X92S I have in the cabinets ported tuned to 55hz and the low end is the only thing the Jordan has over the WR or FR drivers.
Beside from the clear mids on both the WR and FR no contest with the Jordans here and highs out of the WR just stun people who listen to my demo cabinets which are twin post cabinet a set to run the WR fullrange and another that runs the WR and the tweeter along with a network(RAW 1).Well I can never stop watching peoples face time and time agin (just today as a fact for a few more demos) on when people listen to them and then I ask how they sound and then listen to comments 95% say they sound great a small margin say well a little up balanced in the top end.
Well I can hook up the tweeters if you wish!!
NO WAY I here this over and over demo after demo.
Till they get up and put a ear to the tweeter do they all believe that is possible.
And that is just the WR the best I can describe it.
The FR even better!
As for designs.
I will say a wall design is coming fullrange in a few models SOON!
Al
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