planet10 said:
Must admit I was shocked to read that but there it be:
http://www.radioshack.ca/estore/Pro...category=Raw+Speakers+Acc.&catalog=RadioShack
markp said:
Oh... actual stock in the stores, i get it... i always order them at least 10 at a time direct from the website (actually by phone since the website breaks -- at least the last time i used it). I have at least 20 of them in stock
Tim, i haven't measured my last batch yet (and i haven't seen any of the new ones, so don't know if they are the same as the last batch -- purple Canadian boxes)... i'll get around to ordering some sometime (even just to encorage them to keep em coming).
I think you get 5% off if you use your Radio Shack card (a Citibank MC now)
dave
planet10 said:
Oh... actual stock in the stores, i get it... i always order them at least 10 at a time direct from the website (actually by phone since the website breaks -- at least the last time i used it). I have at least 20 of them in stock
dave
Hi Dave,
Can I ask why you keep so many of these drivers on hand?
I have been looking at your website and I like the look (and cost) of the various BD Pipe projects.
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/FALL/bd-pipes.html
In particular, I like the look of the FE103A Pipes and the Red Pipes. I'm interested in these kits and I'd be looking to use 40-1197 drivers. The speakers would be driven by a low wattage (8W max) tube amp.
I have a few questions, in particular with regards to the specifications of these pipes. What sort of power handleing do the pipes have and what is the frequency range? Given that they would be driven by a low power amp, what is the sensitivity of the pipes?
Any comments would be appreciated.
Cheers,
GM.
gmilitano said:
I sell an occasional speaker and many of them use 1197s, so when it looked like they were gonna get scarce i stocked up. Used up about 50 so far.
The wooden pipes with the FE103As now house tweaked 1197s and a "friend" wants them, but he is a bit of a flake, and tey may sit in my living room for awhile. I have an architect client (i do their Macs) and he wanted to hear some of the speakers i had built. One day i had the red pipes in the car (just painted mdf), so i left them with him -- his wife really liked how they looked, and they both liked how they sounded so they wouldn't let me have them back -- has us build another set for the rears, a center channel, and we used the 12" Fosters in his old speakers to build him a push-push sub -- all in red. He also upgraded his electronics to an NAD HT receiver... he likes impressing friends with it.
The BD pipe is probably not an optimal design for a pr of 1197s, it was designed for ACR FE103s using the guess & by golly method -- we just sort of fell into it, my cabinet guy had the boxes done before i could blink and they do work well in the box. GM has done a smaller ML TL that we cribbed for centres that is probably better (we've never had a chance to build a set of mains with this design).
With 1197s the FR is probably 75-80 Hz up to about 10k, then you need to bring a tweeter in with a cap (2 uF on an 8 ohm tweet). There are a number of inexpensive Ts that work well (some less expensive than the postage would be) I expect GMs design would be about the same.
Eficeincy i stimate in about 91 db, a 4.5 W EL84 SEP starts running out of steam at high levels (in my large room) but is superb for normal listing levels. Recent indications are that series wiring may be better sonically than parallel.
dave
Attachments
I realize that the speaker will definitely be "more than loud enough", but is there a possibility of blowing the speaker by turning the volume too high (either accidentally, or by being a showoff)?
I don't want to spend the cash on 4 drivers, and then spend more cash to get other drivers later. I want to get "the right" drivers the first time, and go from there.
Chris
I don't want to spend the cash on 4 drivers, and then spend more cash to get other drivers later. I want to get "the right" drivers the first time, and go from there.
Chris
Timn8ter said:
I think I will definitely have to go for the two-to-a-cabinet approach so that I can squeeze a bit more range out of them. Also, it's not like the drivers will break the bank to muck around with anyway.
From there, if I'm able to build decent-sounding speakers on my own for the office, my wife will allow me to build all the speakers for our surround sound setup at home (since she'd prefer to just drop the cash on ready-made "safe" speakers).
I can sympathize with her attitude right now, since most people just don't think you can reproduce the sound of a "good" (read: expensive) speaker on your own. Also, I've only just recently built things on my own (gainclone) that actually work "as advertised".
I've got a bunch of birch veneer plywood, a fully-functional wood shop, and a small amount of cash to spend on building a set to prove 'em all wrong.
planet10 said:
Thanks for the info, but I still have a few more questions...
Sticking with the pipes (wooden and red), do you have drawing with measurements for them? Do you use a filter or anything on the 40-1197 drivers? How are they connected, series or parallell and are they in phase?
The prototype drawing you posted has several similarities for the AllegraAudio BV-1 (minus the taper). What is the benefit of placing the drivers back to back? Also, do you hook them up in phase? Is the horizontal location of the driver critical? I would prefer to have it a sitting ear level.
Is more information regarding the 40-1197 not available (i.e. freq. responce curves, Re .....)
Cheers
Link to some 40-1197 parameters
http://f18.parsimony.net/forum31999/messages/19030.htm
There have been a few different production runs so YMMV.
http://f18.parsimony.net/forum31999/messages/19030.htm
There have been a few different production runs so YMMV.
gmilitano said:
BD-Pipes plans
http://pmillett.addr.com/tqwp.htm
Drivers connected in parallel or series & in phase (i am starting to get some feedback that, particularily with tube amps, 16 ohms makes a biggere difference than i would have guessed -- i have yet to experiment).
No filters, just "mechanical" tweaks. Ductseal, puzzlecoat, woolfelt, dustcapectomy, phase plugs... the ductseal is a required tweak.
The ptototype is probably similar to Tim's pipes because, he says, he has been inpired by my preaching
Back-to-back makes them CRT friendly and gives optimal push-push coupling (inproved downward dynamic range, reduced transmission of energy to the box). In phase. Driver distance from the end of the pipes is critical. Ajust height by changing the length of the "legs (everything below the port is purly to get the driver up to the right height).
dave
planet10 said:
On that link, it shows a filter, but it is labelled FE103, should I be using that with the 1197? I would be interested in adding a tweeter to this design. Would this be an improvement on the high end? Going along on with your original post, I would be looking at a first order high pass of about 10 kHz. Furthermore, the 40-1030 does not seem to be available anymore would the 10CM (4") WOOFER 40-1022 be an appropriate replacement?
planet10 said:
The ptototype is probably similar to Tim's pipes because, he says, he has been inpired by my preaching
Back-to-back makes them CRT friendly and gives optimal push-push coupling (inproved downward dynamic range, reduced transmission of energy to the box). In phase.
I like this design too. Do I need to experiment with insultation? I believe Tim insulated the upper portion of his. If I was to add a tweeter, does it need to be isolated from the inside of the box?
planet10 said:
Obviously! I dunno what I was thinking?
Ok, with regards to the numbers, the link Tim gave showed an efficiency of about 90.5 db. By using two drivers, what would be the net efficency? I imagine I would need to know this to pick an appropriate tweeter.
I think it is clear that the low end of the 1197 is about 80Hz. How much is this value lowered by the enclosure or by the back to back setup. What I am asking is what would be the estimated frequency responce and would a subwoofer be required.
Cheers,
GM.
gmilitano said:
There is an optional filter, i like the speaker better without it.
The 1197 isn't as extended as the 103/103A/108. The speaker sounds OK without, but you really notice it is missing if you remove it.
Here is a tweeter i've found to work particularily well.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3096034842
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I've only used the same speaker as in the front, i think the 1022 is a bit down efficieny-wise -- i'd just use 2 1197s per box.
No... the designated amount of stuffing just fit into the box.
Tim's uses 2 drivers 90.5-91 dB is about right.
Listen to them, if you want subteranean bass you will need woofers (modern day drivers designed for sub use, usually don't have enuff top end to blend well).
dave
planet10 said:
Thanks for the info Dave.
With regards to the stuffing on the proto-1197-ml-tl, there are no details regarding stuffing.
If the individual drivers are about 90.5 dB, does using two drivers increase the efficiency?
You also mentioned that the height of the enclosure is critical. How is this height determined? Is it based on experimentation, or can software be used to model the enclosure. I have been playing with speaker workshop .. is this approprite or do I need something different?
Thanks,
GM.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.