We did an enclosure for the Magus 8 and the client really likes them. But there are some things that his Vulcans, FHXL (FF165wKeN), Silbury, and Bison all do some things better.
dave
Look great but don't have the sensitivity or HF response of the AER or Voxativ drivers
Great response for fullrange without whizzer. Almost worth it for that alone.
Low sensitivity though.
thanks Planet 10, which fullrange would you choose of AER or Voxativ or have you not listened to them?
Dan
I borrowed a pair of the earlier ones for a while, and liked them very
much. A new pair arrived a few days ago, and I'm looking forward to
giving them some quality time.
In the U.S., you would want to check out HOME
run by ex-Lowther distributor Jon Ver Halen.
I have not heard them, so it would be impossible to pick. They are also VERY pricey.
I’m not a big fan of whizzers. If i want an XO i’ll take it down low with a WAW (and not mechanical).
But listening would be the ultimate decider.
dave
Hi Dan,
a few thoughts about your plans and issues:
- No 8-inch fullrange driver whatsoever will give you 100 dB or even 106 dB 2,83 V 1 m in a small closed enclosure in the region of a few hundert Hz. This could be done with large front horns (Oris for example), but not with CB. These sensitivities, if they´re not pure fantasy, are only attained in the breakup upper middle frequencies and are useless for general calculation and planning.
- Personal opinion: Those fullrange drivers need to be corrected by contour filter, either active (cheaper and easier) or passive (which I personally prefer).
- I´m very sceptic with regard to the "much-too-good" response graphs of several manufacturers mentioned in this thread. The SEAS curves look honest, the Supravox also.
- From my experience (Coral Beta 8, Beta 6, 8 F 60, various Fostexes in all sizes, Visaton B 200, TB 1337 and 1808, EMS and Fertinacoustics) I would suggest to have a look at the EMS LB 8, either with ferrite or fieldcoil motor, this is a pretty good sounding driver (after correction) without having to spend 4-figure-sums. For even less, the W-1808 is quite nice and a good start.
- All of these drivers with their light membranes need utmost care in box design, in order to suppress any reflections through the light cones. Try a solution like xrk´s Dagger or Nautaloss, only bigger, or find your own way to diminish any internal reflections in your box (personally, this is one of the reasons I prefer OB, but of course you´ll need a little room for those...).
Hope that was helpful...
All the best
Mattes
a few thoughts about your plans and issues:
- No 8-inch fullrange driver whatsoever will give you 100 dB or even 106 dB 2,83 V 1 m in a small closed enclosure in the region of a few hundert Hz. This could be done with large front horns (Oris for example), but not with CB. These sensitivities, if they´re not pure fantasy, are only attained in the breakup upper middle frequencies and are useless for general calculation and planning.
- Personal opinion: Those fullrange drivers need to be corrected by contour filter, either active (cheaper and easier) or passive (which I personally prefer).
- I´m very sceptic with regard to the "much-too-good" response graphs of several manufacturers mentioned in this thread. The SEAS curves look honest, the Supravox also.
- From my experience (Coral Beta 8, Beta 6, 8 F 60, various Fostexes in all sizes, Visaton B 200, TB 1337 and 1808, EMS and Fertinacoustics) I would suggest to have a look at the EMS LB 8, either with ferrite or fieldcoil motor, this is a pretty good sounding driver (after correction) without having to spend 4-figure-sums. For even less, the W-1808 is quite nice and a good start.
- All of these drivers with their light membranes need utmost care in box design, in order to suppress any reflections through the light cones. Try a solution like xrk´s Dagger or Nautaloss, only bigger, or find your own way to diminish any internal reflections in your box (personally, this is one of the reasons I prefer OB, but of course you´ll need a little room for those...).
Hope that was helpful...
All the best
Mattes
Thanks Mattes,
i know that manufacturers will often find the best looking graph using various smoothing and room sizes etc, and I don't doubt you at all, but I am wondering with the freq. graph here whether they couldn't have tweaked the lower frequencies (especially from 100Hz and above).
I say this because the speakers, the Zeth and Pi, are not front loaded horns but just ported enclosures, Am I wrong or would that be only increasing spl around the ports frequency? It has obviously had the industry favourite 1/3 octave smoothing.
The price is not too much of an issue. In fact I want to use a high-end driver because I am hoping to make a high-end product as the speaker enclosure will be a sculpture.
I don't mind losing some efficiency for the benefits (my opinion) of sealed.
But all that said I do wan't the most suitable driver and should continue researching. I need a fairly flat and sensitive response.
Supravox do seem like they would work too but most drivers of theirs would need a super-tweeter or you would use their by bi-cone which I guess would be more colouring than Voxativs.
This is the enclosure shape but 5 sided so no parallel surfaces. it has a composite enclosure wall with sheep wool layer inside followed by a thin layer of mundorf twaron unicorn tail hair running laterally from the front to the back (hopefully further focusing the rear wave to the dissipating back point)
What do you guys think about the enclosure shape?
Thanks, Dan
i know that manufacturers will often find the best looking graph using various smoothing and room sizes etc, and I don't doubt you at all, but I am wondering with the freq. graph here whether they couldn't have tweaked the lower frequencies (especially from 100Hz and above).
I say this because the speakers, the Zeth and Pi, are not front loaded horns but just ported enclosures, Am I wrong or would that be only increasing spl around the ports frequency? It has obviously had the industry favourite 1/3 octave smoothing.
The price is not too much of an issue. In fact I want to use a high-end driver because I am hoping to make a high-end product as the speaker enclosure will be a sculpture.
I don't mind losing some efficiency for the benefits (my opinion) of sealed.
But all that said I do wan't the most suitable driver and should continue researching. I need a fairly flat and sensitive response.
Supravox do seem like they would work too but most drivers of theirs would need a super-tweeter or you would use their by bi-cone which I guess would be more colouring than Voxativs.
This is the enclosure shape but 5 sided so no parallel surfaces. it has a composite enclosure wall with sheep wool layer inside followed by a thin layer of mundorf twaron unicorn tail hair running laterally from the front to the back (hopefully further focusing the rear wave to the dissipating back point)
What do you guys think about the enclosure shape?
Thanks, Dan
In my opinion, if you have to make a (closed) box, perhaps a "teardrop" is the best shape for dissipating internal reflections. Cube is the worst. So, in your case, it would be more difficult to build, but worth trying...
P.s. spherical isn't bad too, I've seen spherical "balls" made out two Ikea wooden bowls. Last time I shopped in IKEA, I almost bought four pieces (I didn't, because my wife said that we have enough bowls - of course she had no clue what was on my mind
)
P.s. spherical isn't bad too, I've seen spherical "balls" made out two Ikea wooden bowls. Last time I shopped in IKEA, I almost bought four pieces (I didn't, because my wife said that we have enough bowls - of course she had no clue what was on my mind
)
Hi Dan,
your enclosure sketch looks good, this (or a teardrop as Vix suggests) is the way to go to avoid inner reflections. Use your stuffing progressively, getting denser further away from the driver. I would make the first angle from the driver side a little less steep - in your sketch it looks like 50 or 55 degrees, 35 might be better. What material are you intending to use?
Regarding the graphs, I will not judge those, but if you search for tests and reviews of loudspeakers with these drivers, you will find more frequency response graphs online, and you´ll need to judge those as well by yourself...
There are many who prefer a flat response on axis, others look for even power response, some only at 30 degrees, some don´t care at all. There are many opinions and many solutions, I could offer my personal view, but there´s a good chance it won´t be valid for yourself.
So, if money is no issue, and as you want to make a sculpture, I would suggest to have a look at the "artsy" Fertinacoustics drivers without suspension, clearly influenced by the classic Goodmans Axiom 80 (Disclaimer: I´m in friendly contact with the owner and manufacturer of Fertinacoustics, but have no commercial connection or interest whatsoever. Disclaimer again: I´m heavily biased, as I have a pair of Fertinacoustics 20M8EX, for which I paid dear and worked long and hard...).
Or hunt for a perfect pair of CORAL Beta 8, still one of the most beautiful drivers ever, and still very good...
However, interesting project!!! What shape and size for the bass enclosure?
All the best
Mattes
your enclosure sketch looks good, this (or a teardrop as Vix suggests) is the way to go to avoid inner reflections. Use your stuffing progressively, getting denser further away from the driver. I would make the first angle from the driver side a little less steep - in your sketch it looks like 50 or 55 degrees, 35 might be better. What material are you intending to use?
Regarding the graphs, I will not judge those, but if you search for tests and reviews of loudspeakers with these drivers, you will find more frequency response graphs online, and you´ll need to judge those as well by yourself...
There are many who prefer a flat response on axis, others look for even power response, some only at 30 degrees, some don´t care at all. There are many opinions and many solutions, I could offer my personal view, but there´s a good chance it won´t be valid for yourself.
So, if money is no issue, and as you want to make a sculpture, I would suggest to have a look at the "artsy" Fertinacoustics drivers without suspension, clearly influenced by the classic Goodmans Axiom 80 (Disclaimer: I´m in friendly contact with the owner and manufacturer of Fertinacoustics, but have no commercial connection or interest whatsoever. Disclaimer again: I´m heavily biased, as I have a pair of Fertinacoustics 20M8EX, for which I paid dear and worked long and hard...).
Or hunt for a perfect pair of CORAL Beta 8, still one of the most beautiful drivers ever, and still very good...
However, interesting project!!! What shape and size for the bass enclosure?
All the best
Mattes
Attachments
Well, this is the previous pair of speakers I made.
They are made from finest welsh slate, 2 layers with a fluid bitumen core followed by polyurethane foam, sheepwool then mundorf twaron unicorn tail hair (dunno where they farm the unicorns).
Manger sound transducer
WBT Topline Pole Terminal, Gold Plated and Neotech NEI-3002 MKIII, UP-OCC 99.99998% pure 125m copper crystal screened cable x2 per speaker (one for positive and one for negative).
And so the new pair I'm making will be the same methodology but a dodecahedron based design and larger.
I haven't decided on my sub-woofer method yet, (soooo many options, but airing towards sealed dual opposed and/or isobaric for <20Hz - 50Hz and second driver for 50Hz to xover point which depends on the widebander used but could be as high as 300Hz to get the most out of the Manger.
Hope you like,
Dan
They are made from finest welsh slate, 2 layers with a fluid bitumen core followed by polyurethane foam, sheepwool then mundorf twaron unicorn tail hair (dunno where they farm the unicorns).
Manger sound transducer
WBT Topline Pole Terminal, Gold Plated and Neotech NEI-3002 MKIII, UP-OCC 99.99998% pure 125m copper crystal screened cable x2 per speaker (one for positive and one for negative).
And so the new pair I'm making will be the same methodology but a dodecahedron based design and larger.
I haven't decided on my sub-woofer method yet, (soooo many options, but airing towards sealed dual opposed and/or isobaric for <20Hz - 50Hz and second driver for 50Hz to xover point which depends on the widebander used but could be as high as 300Hz to get the most out of the Manger.
Hope you like,
Dan
Last edited:
Hi Dan,
looks like you´ve been already where most of us have never been...
So, you have a very esoteric and nice design with the Manger (by the way: Daniela decided not to sell drivers anymore... the only way to get Manger drivers nowadays is used ones or NOS, if someone has them lying around collecting dust) which has been realised in, as it seems, highest quality.
Where do you want to go from there? More exotic, more expensive (possible for sure...), or even better sound (whatever that is...)?
Do you keep your speakers or do you sell them after completion?
Many love the Manger drivers, many don´t like them. I belong to the latter group - always found the drivers a little boring, but of course that´s subjective and of course I´ve not heard your speakers.
Wondering about the reasons behind all that, I remain
with best regards
Mattes
looks like you´ve been already where most of us have never been...
So, you have a very esoteric and nice design with the Manger (by the way: Daniela decided not to sell drivers anymore... the only way to get Manger drivers nowadays is used ones or NOS, if someone has them lying around collecting dust) which has been realised in, as it seems, highest quality.
Where do you want to go from there? More exotic, more expensive (possible for sure...), or even better sound (whatever that is...)?
Do you keep your speakers or do you sell them after completion?
Many love the Manger drivers, many don´t like them. I belong to the latter group - always found the drivers a little boring, but of course that´s subjective and of course I´ve not heard your speakers.
Wondering about the reasons behind all that, I remain
with best regards
Mattes
Thanks Mattes,
I do intend to sell the speakers and am attempting to make a portfolio for a business selling a small range of high-end speakers made from slate, marble, granite, quartzite, etc.
I bought the drivers new from Manger a while ago and have had them in a few enclosures since. It was always my plan to develop a product using the Manger driver but now the product I made has to be a one of a kind.
So where to from here? well I almost agree with your manger opinion. They don't have a powerful sound but more of an incredibly silky smooth sound that is very well suited to voices and most instruments so classical, Jazz, and other instrumental and melodic styles suit them where rock or very hard electric music sounds slightly lacking on the power drum performances. They also have a low maximum spl. I believe that these things would not be the case with Voxativ though.
My frequency response in The Dolmens didn't have any real issue in the 1.7kHz region where Troels Gravesen measured a major dip which he believed to ruin the sound on certain female voices. Well I personally believe that female voices sound very real with the Manger and couldn't detect any drop in response.
Where they excel is in the speed with which they handle transients but the recording has to be very good for this reason (they show up any problem details)
So yeah, my plan is to make more complex sculptures using firstly a wideband driver design and a sub woofer to match, and after that I hope to make an Accuton based multi-way design.
Thanks also for the Fertin acoustics tip. I think that they look incredible, if not the best looking drivers I've ever seen. Unfortunately there is very little information on them. They are also better suited to smaller sealed enclosure volumes than all my other options which is a big advantage.
Are you able to give a frequency response for them?
Do you know how they compare with the other expensive full-range drivers?
Thanks, Dan
I do intend to sell the speakers and am attempting to make a portfolio for a business selling a small range of high-end speakers made from slate, marble, granite, quartzite, etc.
I bought the drivers new from Manger a while ago and have had them in a few enclosures since. It was always my plan to develop a product using the Manger driver but now the product I made has to be a one of a kind.
So where to from here? well I almost agree with your manger opinion. They don't have a powerful sound but more of an incredibly silky smooth sound that is very well suited to voices and most instruments so classical, Jazz, and other instrumental and melodic styles suit them where rock or very hard electric music sounds slightly lacking on the power drum performances. They also have a low maximum spl. I believe that these things would not be the case with Voxativ though.
My frequency response in The Dolmens didn't have any real issue in the 1.7kHz region where Troels Gravesen measured a major dip which he believed to ruin the sound on certain female voices. Well I personally believe that female voices sound very real with the Manger and couldn't detect any drop in response.
Where they excel is in the speed with which they handle transients but the recording has to be very good for this reason (they show up any problem details)
So yeah, my plan is to make more complex sculptures using firstly a wideband driver design and a sub woofer to match, and after that I hope to make an Accuton based multi-way design.
Thanks also for the Fertin acoustics tip. I think that they look incredible, if not the best looking drivers I've ever seen. Unfortunately there is very little information on them. They are also better suited to smaller sealed enclosure volumes than all my other options which is a big advantage.
Are you able to give a frequency response for them?
Do you know how they compare with the other expensive full-range drivers?
Thanks, Dan
Hi Dan,
sorry, no time in the moment, I´m very busy at work in the country of Stig-Erik, Kaffimann and many others.
I will provide an extended answer soon, and as I´m the proud owner of (up to my and the manufacturers knowledge) the only pair of a Fertinacoustics 20M8EX (with fieldcoil motor) in Germany, I may provide a little bit of experience with this rare driver, too.
Best regards
Mattes
sorry, no time in the moment, I´m very busy at work in the country of Stig-Erik, Kaffimann and many others.
I will provide an extended answer soon, and as I´m the proud owner of (up to my and the manufacturers knowledge) the only pair of a Fertinacoustics 20M8EX (with fieldcoil motor) in Germany, I may provide a little bit of experience with this rare driver, too.
Best regards
Mattes
Thanks Mattes, If you are able to when your not too busy that would be really useful to me.
I wish I could test and listen to all these different drivers myself but it would involve either buying them all (dream on) or a thousand mile trip to all the different shops who have them (very few and far between in the UK)
The Vb for a Qtc of 0.707 with the fertin ferrite 21S M8 is 8.09 litres !!!
very small compared with the other manufacturers and ideal for my designs
I just have to know that they are unquestionably highest quality sound from them. I will be putting a lot of money and time into this project and have to have a great speaker and not just a great sculpture at the end.
Thanks again,
Dan
I wish I could test and listen to all these different drivers myself but it would involve either buying them all (dream on) or a thousand mile trip to all the different shops who have them (very few and far between in the UK)
The Vb for a Qtc of 0.707 with the fertin ferrite 21S M8 is 8.09 litres !!!
very small compared with the other manufacturers and ideal for my designs
I just have to know that they are unquestionably highest quality sound from them. I will be putting a lot of money and time into this project and have to have a great speaker and not just a great sculpture at the end.
Thanks again,
Dan
Hi Dan,
found some time, will try to give a few informations.
First, just a few words about the Manger MSW: I agree with your impression of smoothness, but for me it has always been too polite. I listen to acoustical jazz mostly, and I like modern european stuff the most, scandinavian jazz trios, the ECM style... but in my opinion music must be reproduced with original loudness, otherwise the illusion of the jazz trio in my room doesn´t work.
Therefore, I require that my speaker are able to reproduce a piano, an upright bass, with realistic level. There are people who claim to do this with small drivers, loaded into whatever... I don´t believe in this. I wouldn´t ask an 8-inch driver to reproduce anything below 200 Hz, I have an 18-inch-driver for that (in my actual "prototype", the crossover frequency is around 350 Hz, against common wisdom...).
I was never persuaded enough on various occasions to buy a MSW. I have a variety of fullrange drivers at home, with some of them I´m sure to get more pleasure.
That leads us to the Fertinacoustics 20M8.
I had the TB 1808, a fine driver for not too much money. After a while, I wanted more and, with a sceptic mind, purchased a pair of EMS LB8MkII, and it was a little bit better, although more critical to application, filtering, electronics...
Of course, the law of diminishing returns is always valid... in the end, I paid a lot for small differences, but never regretted it, as I liked the LB8 much better, never looked back.
Driven by the challenge to find my personal, subjective "best" fullrange driver, I listened to a lot of drivers, always under different conditions... but an impression was always there. I have listened to Feastrex drivers (only once, long ago), to some Voxativ loudspeakers (on various occasions), to the original Janus 70 of Monsieur Deminiere in France, and also to the Fertinacoustics 20M8 with ferrite motor and with fieldcoil motor, and finally decided to buy the latter.
As you asked for differences, there are a few details that persuaded the technician in me: Cone and whizzer are curvilinear, not straight. The form of the whizzer is what, in my opinion, stands out from all other drivers, and I´m fully persuaded that it´s better than all other whizzers. Finally, the edgeless design, which follows the old ideas of Mr. Jordan when he designed the Goodmans Axiom 80, seems to be a contributing factor to speed, precision and dynamics as well (I must admit that I´m a precision and resolution freak...). Oh well, and of course the fieldcoil motor, I had a chance to compare both motors 1 to 1 and liked the fieldcoil better...
The Fertinacoustics 20M8 is a very rare bird. I travelled to the south of France to listen to it, and then later I travelled a second time to pick it up (by train, due to weight of the units and due to the fact that I didn´t wanted to drive 3500 km by car in 2 days... it took me only 46 hours by train for the trip...). You can place an order (in french, of course. The manufacturer is more artisan than technician...) and once your drivers are ready, you may pick them up personally, the owner does not like to ship the drivers, due to fragility and weight.
These drivers are Divas. If there´s just a small issue in electronics, application, filter, or most common in the quality of the recording, they´ll let you know.
I have never encountered such a critical driver, and I´m still trying to get the best out of them...
Once everything is OK, they sing like no other... speed, microdynamics, macrodynamics, tone... it´s all there. For me (and as always, this are my personal impressions only. You might come to a total different judgement...), the illusion of the small jazz band in my room is more perfect than with other drivers.
And of course, this is one of the most sexy looking drivers...
A few words on application: I have my Fertinacoustics on small, open, swinging baffles, passively filtered at around 350 Hz, and the filter also corrects the frequency response. I have attached a few measurements of my own - but sadly, I´m not good with this. Some manufacturers data as well - seems he´s also not so keen about measurements, he likes more to listen to music.
If you´re heading that direction, I would suggest to try an EMS LB8 first. You will get an impression of the french school of doing fullranges, and if you don´t like it, you haven´t burned that much money... I could even sell my used pair, should you be interested.
If you like it, and want a little bit more of it, try the Fertinacoustics... These 2 drivers share a lot of similarities, soundwise, and as long as we´re talking ferrite motors, they share the baskets as well. The owners of both companies are friends.
You´re right, there´s very little information to be found. The only application of the driver I´m aware of was the Da Vinci Virtu loudspeaker, there are a few impressions to be found. That was build with the Fertinacoustics 20M7, which has also been discussed in ths forum, but long ago. The 20M8 is the actual model.
A final word: I have a hard time to imagine this driver in a 9 liter CB. It might be correct from calculations, but if it was me, I would make the volume a lot larger...
All the best
Mattes
found some time, will try to give a few informations.
First, just a few words about the Manger MSW: I agree with your impression of smoothness, but for me it has always been too polite. I listen to acoustical jazz mostly, and I like modern european stuff the most, scandinavian jazz trios, the ECM style... but in my opinion music must be reproduced with original loudness, otherwise the illusion of the jazz trio in my room doesn´t work.
Therefore, I require that my speaker are able to reproduce a piano, an upright bass, with realistic level. There are people who claim to do this with small drivers, loaded into whatever... I don´t believe in this. I wouldn´t ask an 8-inch driver to reproduce anything below 200 Hz, I have an 18-inch-driver for that (in my actual "prototype", the crossover frequency is around 350 Hz, against common wisdom...).
I was never persuaded enough on various occasions to buy a MSW. I have a variety of fullrange drivers at home, with some of them I´m sure to get more pleasure.
That leads us to the Fertinacoustics 20M8.
I had the TB 1808, a fine driver for not too much money. After a while, I wanted more and, with a sceptic mind, purchased a pair of EMS LB8MkII, and it was a little bit better, although more critical to application, filtering, electronics...
Of course, the law of diminishing returns is always valid... in the end, I paid a lot for small differences, but never regretted it, as I liked the LB8 much better, never looked back.
Driven by the challenge to find my personal, subjective "best" fullrange driver, I listened to a lot of drivers, always under different conditions... but an impression was always there. I have listened to Feastrex drivers (only once, long ago), to some Voxativ loudspeakers (on various occasions), to the original Janus 70 of Monsieur Deminiere in France, and also to the Fertinacoustics 20M8 with ferrite motor and with fieldcoil motor, and finally decided to buy the latter.
As you asked for differences, there are a few details that persuaded the technician in me: Cone and whizzer are curvilinear, not straight. The form of the whizzer is what, in my opinion, stands out from all other drivers, and I´m fully persuaded that it´s better than all other whizzers. Finally, the edgeless design, which follows the old ideas of Mr. Jordan when he designed the Goodmans Axiom 80, seems to be a contributing factor to speed, precision and dynamics as well (I must admit that I´m a precision and resolution freak...). Oh well, and of course the fieldcoil motor, I had a chance to compare both motors 1 to 1 and liked the fieldcoil better...
The Fertinacoustics 20M8 is a very rare bird. I travelled to the south of France to listen to it, and then later I travelled a second time to pick it up (by train, due to weight of the units and due to the fact that I didn´t wanted to drive 3500 km by car in 2 days... it took me only 46 hours by train for the trip...). You can place an order (in french, of course. The manufacturer is more artisan than technician...) and once your drivers are ready, you may pick them up personally, the owner does not like to ship the drivers, due to fragility and weight.
These drivers are Divas. If there´s just a small issue in electronics, application, filter, or most common in the quality of the recording, they´ll let you know.
I have never encountered such a critical driver, and I´m still trying to get the best out of them...
Once everything is OK, they sing like no other... speed, microdynamics, macrodynamics, tone... it´s all there. For me (and as always, this are my personal impressions only. You might come to a total different judgement...), the illusion of the small jazz band in my room is more perfect than with other drivers.
And of course, this is one of the most sexy looking drivers...
A few words on application: I have my Fertinacoustics on small, open, swinging baffles, passively filtered at around 350 Hz, and the filter also corrects the frequency response. I have attached a few measurements of my own - but sadly, I´m not good with this. Some manufacturers data as well - seems he´s also not so keen about measurements, he likes more to listen to music.
If you´re heading that direction, I would suggest to try an EMS LB8 first. You will get an impression of the french school of doing fullranges, and if you don´t like it, you haven´t burned that much money... I could even sell my used pair, should you be interested.
If you like it, and want a little bit more of it, try the Fertinacoustics... These 2 drivers share a lot of similarities, soundwise, and as long as we´re talking ferrite motors, they share the baskets as well. The owners of both companies are friends.
You´re right, there´s very little information to be found. The only application of the driver I´m aware of was the Da Vinci Virtu loudspeaker, there are a few impressions to be found. That was build with the Fertinacoustics 20M7, which has also been discussed in ths forum, but long ago. The 20M8 is the actual model.
A final word: I have a hard time to imagine this driver in a 9 liter CB. It might be correct from calculations, but if it was me, I would make the volume a lot larger...
All the best
Mattes
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