I got this idea because some of the 'ceiling to floor' line array projects in the Full Range Section look awesome and I'm really curious of their sound.
I recently put together 4 BK12m enclosures using the Markaudio 4" Pluvia 7's and they sounded really good. Good enough to continue on this path, maybe?...
The problem with the Pluvia 7's is their lack of power, i.e. output volume, so I'm thinking in this case maybe more is better.
In my collection so far I have 6 Pluvia 7's which I can start a mini-line array with 3 drivers per side.
The BK12m's will not be used. I already built 2 custom boxes which are 6"x6"x21", 3/4" MDF with a 2" vent 1" long centered in the rear of the box. Internally, it figures to .3 cubic ft. Tomorrow, I'd like to build 4 more boxes and retest. Seems to be falling off at about 150Hz 6in from rear wall...
The reason for building a separate box for each driver was so each stacked box could be pointed or moved out in a stereo pattern for experimentation.
I know there's things like lobing and comb filter and such I've read about, but I have no software to test such things.
As time goes by I would build more speakers and stack them. They would be attached by a dowel pin in 3 possible positions as I will drill holes to accomodate the pins towards the front middle and back of each speaker, on top and bottom of course.
So what do you guys think?
Best regards,
Sam
I recently put together 4 BK12m enclosures using the Markaudio 4" Pluvia 7's and they sounded really good. Good enough to continue on this path, maybe?...
The problem with the Pluvia 7's is their lack of power, i.e. output volume, so I'm thinking in this case maybe more is better.
In my collection so far I have 6 Pluvia 7's which I can start a mini-line array with 3 drivers per side.
The BK12m's will not be used. I already built 2 custom boxes which are 6"x6"x21", 3/4" MDF with a 2" vent 1" long centered in the rear of the box. Internally, it figures to .3 cubic ft. Tomorrow, I'd like to build 4 more boxes and retest. Seems to be falling off at about 150Hz 6in from rear wall...
The reason for building a separate box for each driver was so each stacked box could be pointed or moved out in a stereo pattern for experimentation.
I know there's things like lobing and comb filter and such I've read about, but I have no software to test such things.
As time goes by I would build more speakers and stack them. They would be attached by a dowel pin in 3 possible positions as I will drill holes to accomodate the pins towards the front middle and back of each speaker, on top and bottom of course.
So what do you guys think?
Best regards,
Sam
There once was a company called seventh veil that had a four driver array. He had his own sub you could purchase with it. I got to hear a set and I really liked them. Granted you had to be sitting at the right height but that was easy. Most of us are sitting when we do critical or major relaxation listening anyway. Google "seventh veil speakers".
Just a few thoughts, don't mean to be rude here,
This stacking will prevent you from getting the drivers as close together as possible. This will lower the frequency at which combing will occur. With a stack of 3 drivers this may not be detrimental on the listening axis though. But once you move up or down at the listening spot this combing will start to play a bigger role.
Most floor to ceiling line arrays have the drivers 'as close together as possible' for a reason. They are also 'floor to ceiling' for a good reason.
However there is nothing wrong with experimenting
.
This stacking will prevent you from getting the drivers as close together as possible. This will lower the frequency at which combing will occur. With a stack of 3 drivers this may not be detrimental on the listening axis though. But once you move up or down at the listening spot this combing will start to play a bigger role.
Most floor to ceiling line arrays have the drivers 'as close together as possible' for a reason. They are also 'floor to ceiling' for a good reason.
However there is nothing wrong with experimenting
.Dr1v3n,
Since you are experimenting, can you try and connect the drivers in series and run the bottom driver as a 0.5 driver? Please refer to post #4 by Danny Ritchie in this thread:
Best Sounding Single Drivers
Since you are experimenting, can you try and connect the drivers in series and run the bottom driver as a 0.5 driver? Please refer to post #4 by Danny Ritchie in this thread:
Best Sounding Single Drivers
Sam - read Ronald's thread .
Pluvia7 is a nice driver, but perhaps a bit of overkill for a line array. One of the most popular models for such an application is the Peerless / Vifa Peerless by Tymphany TC9FD18-08 3-1/2" Full Range Paper Cone Woofer
Keep in mind that a full blown floor to ceiling array usually implements at least 20 per side, so budget accordingly - must be a reason for the specific quantity price breaks on PE's site.
Pluvia7 is a nice driver, but perhaps a bit of overkill for a line array. One of the most popular models for such an application is the Peerless / Vifa Peerless by Tymphany TC9FD18-08 3-1/2" Full Range Paper Cone Woofer
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Keep in mind that a full blown floor to ceiling array usually implements at least 20 per side, so budget accordingly - must be a reason for the specific quantity price breaks on PE's site.
That is a great link! I'll try it and measure it. I'm lacking a 3.5mm to stereo RCA cable to run REW to my 3 Audiosuorce AMP 3's with test signals from my laptop. I should get it tomorrow.
Just so you all know, I am trying to beat the glorious sound that was coming from the 4x BK12m setup using the Pluvia 7's, from this thread (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/305513-modified-bk-12m-blh-3.html#post5036362). If an array type arrangement can't be done with these drivers, then I'll stay with the BK12m's.
So I did finish the last 2 Left & Right speakers although I'm short a couple sets of binding posts. The one on top has the 4.5"passive radiator. After comparing them all, the one with the largest vent had the lowest frequencies. I'm going to work with this design and convert all 6 to that one first. Then I plan on experimenting along the lines of pipe organ. Always loved that sound the best when I was young.
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Sam, there's probably no doubt that a successful line array could be accomplished with almost any competent small FR driver, but please pay heed to comments by Ronald (wesayso) and several other members here, as well as examples by folks like Roger Russell. With such a contemplated project, go full floor to ceiling - which generally requires at least 20 drivers per side - or risk disappointing results that is not due to the concept, but rather the implementation.
I tested using box design with the recommended vent piece. I thought this sounded the best today, so I went on to testing with REW software measuring RTA and outputting Pink noise through headphone jack of the Toshiba Satellite laptop, U-Phoria UM2 and Dayton Emm-6 mic, calibration file used. Personally, I like what I see. I always liked a bit of 'brightness' from a speaker
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Exactly, that was my original intent, in addition to be able to put each stacked speaker off axis for spreading the sound!
Well I'm starting off slow, as I am revisiting an old hobby after a great many years of progress. I was programming a Commodore 64 when I built my first set of speaker experiments. I was in my late teens then... Anyway
In REW, I made 2 measurements on these boxes using the log sweep function. I think this is way more revealing than pink noise, but I'm not an audio engineer, so any input would be appreciated!
Here are the curves based on the Pluvia 7 driver in a (internal measurement) box size of 4.5"x6"x20" with the recommended vent 1.5" vent x 4"
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Tomorrow I'll try to add some internal baffling in order to see what affect it has on the lower frequencies. Maybe upper? Maybe I can affect those freq's enough to successfully stack 2 different designs without comb filtering?
I'm thinking even though the bass notes are impressive, to add a hi-pass crossover to save the drivers and have a cleaner midrange/high sound.
Overall I am really impressed with these drivers.
I'm gonna have a beer and listen to music. Done with the FFT's for tonight, Cheers
I'm thinking even though the bass notes are impressive, to add a hi-pass crossover to save the drivers and have a cleaner midrange/high sound.
Overall I am really impressed with these drivers.
I'm gonna have a beer and listen to music. Done with the FFT's for tonight, Cheers
Today I made 4 speaker stands, 54" tall. They have a dual purpose of supporting 4 wall mounted bookshelves when not being tasked for audio use.
Now I tested the Pluvia 7's in 2 of the .32cu.ft. enclosures on the stands, far away from all walls, and even with the 2" vent it was seriously lacking in lower frequencies.
Now on to 2 pairs of stacked enclosures, on the stands, in the middle of the garage...
I tried many things, except internal baffling mods as I don't think this affects comb filtering so much. This is what we're battling here. And I think back to How successful D'Appolito, now MTM?, sounded.
The only arrangement that sounded half decent was to have the bottom left and right pair Pointed towards the rear, and the top pair aimed slightly off axis towards the front.
I have the advantage of powering the bottom pair and top pair independently at this point
Now I tested the Pluvia 7's in 2 of the .32cu.ft. enclosures on the stands, far away from all walls, and even with the 2" vent it was seriously lacking in lower frequencies.
Now on to 2 pairs of stacked enclosures, on the stands, in the middle of the garage...
I tried many things, except internal baffling mods as I don't think this affects comb filtering so much. This is what we're battling here. And I think back to How successful D'Appolito, now MTM?, sounded.
The only arrangement that sounded half decent was to have the bottom left and right pair Pointed towards the rear, and the top pair aimed slightly off axis towards the front.
I have the advantage of powering the bottom pair and top pair independently at this point
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