Is it sensible to use a sub to relieve effort from a single driver BLH? - Page 3 - diyAudio
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Old 20th March 2017, 12:50 AM   #21
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Whoa!!! Chill.
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Yeah, unfortunately I don't really think that people using porcelain insulators for the cables, and say that "black CDs sound better" have any idea about how to design speakers either. They totally lost me here: "But that's not the end of this tweak. As the story goes, in order to get the best transfer to a black disk, you need a dedicated laptop with an external CD burner. And during the burning process, the laptop runs off its battery. "
Geez -


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Old 20th March 2017, 06:17 AM   #22
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Old 21st March 2017, 05:05 AM   #23
hugz is offline hugz  Australia
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Do you ever get that weird feeling, like your thread may be in the process of getting derailed?

Anyway, I'm not playing window shaking bass or anything, but even some classical music can get the drivers vibrating quite hard sometimes. I was listening to some Tchaikovsky and was again wondering if any of the highs/mids are being distorted due to the lows.

I'm looking into FAST now though.
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Old 21st March 2017, 05:15 AM   #24
GM is offline GM  United States
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Absolutely! Frequency and amplitude modulation distortion [FMD, AMD] is very real, especially in 'FR' driver reproduction: https://www.klippel.de/fileadmin/kli...Distortion.pdf

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Old 21st March 2017, 09:08 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hugz View Post
Do you ever get that weird feeling, like your thread may be in the process of getting derailed?

Anyway, I'm not playing window shaking bass or anything, but even some classical music can get the drivers vibrating quite hard sometimes. I was listening to some Tchaikovsky and was again wondering if any of the highs/mids are being distorted due to the lows.

I'm looking into FAST now though.
Bare i mind lowest A on the piano, fundamental is 27Hz. Ok, not played very often but consider what happens when the sustain pedal is used. One example why, for accurate reproduction, you need the low frequencies. I think you are making the right choice, you have nothing to loose.
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Old 21st March 2017, 10:52 AM   #26
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I have a similar layout, with a Bastanis 12" running full range. The sub has a lowpass filter, the Bastanis runs without a crossover.

I would only consider a high pass crossover, if it was in the digital domain, before amplification.

Otherwise it compromises the benefits mentioned by Scott Joplin, above.

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Old 22nd March 2017, 10:29 AM   #27
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To add something constructive to the thread :

Yesterday I added the Alsa equalizer module to my Raspberry Pi IQAudIO player, and tried to see if there is any potential for raising the bass in my Dallas II. In order to try and keep the digital distortion minimal, I attenuated the mid and high bands, mirroring the response curves I got with measuring with REW.
This reduced the volume, which was compensated by increasing the volume with my amp.
I can say that the Dallas II has a lot of potential for stronger and very tight bass at quite loud volumes (estimated up to 10-12W, which is more than enough for a 98dB speaker). Go much louder than that might cause the FE206En to audibly distort). So there are some reserves that can be exploited and adjusted to taste.
Personally I do not like listening to bass heavy music, and I like to keep the soundpath as pure as possible. So after playing a bit (30 minutes) with it I turned off the equalizer and returned everything to normal. Maybe someone with more time can experiment longer with it and report back..
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Old 22nd March 2017, 11:42 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fb2017 View Post
To add something constructive to the thread :

Yesterday I added the Alsa equalizer module to my Raspberry Pi IQAudIO player, and tried to see if there is any potential for raising the bass in my Dallas II. In order to try and keep the digital distortion minimal, I attenuated the mid and high bands, mirroring the response curves I got with measuring with REW.
That's what a crossover does. This minimizes "what GM said", [FMD, AMD]

Search also for "pistonic behavior" of a loudspeaker, in order to comprehend why three different sources ( wf/mid/tw ) can work together when put in their passband working region
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Old 22nd March 2017, 11:54 AM   #29
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Actually a crossover tries to completely erase the not needed bands. I just slightly reduced (attenuated) the mids and highs a few dB. The system is still fullrange, but with a bit of focus on bass. Anyway. for the Dallas II, measurements show that above 200Hz, the horn has close to no influence. Replacing the horn (or much of it) with a sub and we waste the design, know-how and built hours put into these big boxes them for a doubtful benefit.

I was just trying to offer an alternative to that, by moderate equalizing.. Anyway Dallas II does offer some very good bass, and they even can be tuned (a bit) lower. I wonder how many here have heard them?

Last edited by fb2017; 22nd March 2017 at 12:00 PM.
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