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Old 20th February 2015, 10:50 PM   #1
makar0n is offline makar0n  Poland
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Default back loaded horn project for se 2a3 (~3W)

hi,

my name is Lukas and I just started a double project. I would like to build myself a single end 2a3 amp (and this part looks fairly easy. I have blueprints and a soldering iron ).

the second part of the project are loudspeakers ( I slowly start thinking that loudspeakers should be the first part ).

because amp will be on the lower site of the force (~3W), I need very sensitive loudspeakers. at first I thought about fostex 206en, but fostex have a lot of adverse opinions.
then I chose tang band w8-1772 drivers as very similar but without bad shadow.

now, could you please help me to find a nice blh cabinet project for tang band w8-1772 drivers?

if it will be free of charge - excelent, but I can pay for plans some (reasonable) money.

I found a manufacturer's (tang band) project of blh cabinets, but I do not quite like it. I would like to build speakers like: dallas II, jericho horn (both for fostex 206), signature two (lowther), etc.

some information:
room size: 3x4m
speaker sizes: width up to 400-500mm, deep - even more, seling is on heigt 2400mm

I do not know what other info is needed. tell me please and I will provide it.

Lukas

Last edited by makar0n; 21st February 2015 at 12:25 AM.
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Old 20th February 2015, 10:55 PM   #2
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The TB are not nearly as efficient as the Fostex... about 4 dB by my measures.

And i don't know how suitable it is for a horn.

dave
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Old 20th February 2015, 11:01 PM   #3
makar0n is offline makar0n  Poland
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that's a point, but fostex need an extra high frequency driver = crossover.
I would like to avoid anything between amp and driver if possible.

what driver would you suggest? apart from forstex and tang band. and cheaper than a small car .
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Old 20th February 2015, 11:12 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makar0n View Post
that's a point, but fostex need an extra high frequency driver = crossover.
No more than the TB. The Fostex has some annoying peaks, the source of the so-called Fostex shout, We treat/modify the drivers to get rid of the worst of that. The TB is smoother.

Quote:
what driver would you suggest? apart from forstex and tang band. and cheaper than a small car .
You might consider the Mark Audio Alpair 12p. A touch more efficient than the TB, but the Alpairs efficiency always seems to belie how much power you can get away with. And there is a good horn for it.

Woden Design | Avebury

Same site has a similar horn for the FE206

dave
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Old 20th February 2015, 11:57 PM   #5
makar0n is offline makar0n  Poland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
The Fostex has some annoying peaks, the source of the so-called Fostex shout, We treat/modify the drivers to get rid of the worst of that.
could you please paste a link to methodology of this "treatment"? I am very interested.
but still, price of fostex supertweeter is

Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
You might consider the Mark Audio Alpair 12p. A touch more efficient than the TB, but the Alpairs efficiency always seems to belie how much power you can get away with. And there is a good horn for it.
alpair seems to be the weakest in effiency
all from datasheets

alpair 12p 91.73dB
fostex 206en 96dB
tb w8-1772 95dB

Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
I like it . but 89dB ... will it be enough for ~3W midget?

Lukas
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Old 21st February 2015, 12:31 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makar0n View Post
alpair seems to be the weakest in effiency
all from datasheets

alpair 12p 91.73dB
fostex 206en 96dB
tb w8-1772 95dB
TB measures just under 92. Alpair much the same, Fostex just over 95.

TB is noted for fairly variable specs depending on the batch, and in this case stretch the reality by hand=picking the point they use to specify the efficiency

dave
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Old 21st February 2015, 02:11 AM   #7
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I have the W8-1772, and I built Bob Brines' design and it is nice, but it needs a bit of EQ to shine in my room.

If I had the space, I would try the WIBAQ, which is a TABAQ on steroids!

The WIBAQ: TABAQ Design with Betsy K
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Old 21st February 2015, 05:15 AM   #8
freddi is offline freddi  United States
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planet10 has a good description of W8-1772 - imo, its smooth, well damped (maybe overly for some tastes) and sounds "hi-fi" - something like a well executed 2-way - but sometimes I prefer FE206EN even with its hard peak as I use Karlson. A 2a3 probably needs close to a real 100dB speaker to shine . 1772 could use 20 watts or more. 1772 seemed to like the old BK20 small blh - but I didn't take measurements. Alpair are considered to be good alternatives.
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Old 21st February 2015, 11:57 AM   #9
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1772 in the old BK20 would be an interesting option -it's going to be undersized for the driver requirements & since it's not tuned especially low, that will likely result in not a lot happening on the bottom end, but a fair old kick through the mid & upper bass region.

I don't mind the 1772. It's a sort of avereagely average Mr McAverage widebander. Doesn't do much objectionable, but nor does it particularly excel in any areas. It wouldn't be my first choice, but it looks nice, if you like that kind of thing, and does a solid enough job. I prefer the Fostex & MA units mentioned, but YMMV as always -different strokes for different folks & all that.

If you want to get the best from the 1772 (or take it low), then as far as back-horns go, it requires a fairly substantial enclosure given its moderate Q and Vas. That applies to all drivers of course -up to a limit (which is usually far beyond what most people are willing to tolerate anyway) bigger is better when it comes to horns. But with those specs., it tends to be larger than some others, especially when you factor in the output impedance of your proposed 2A3 SET amps, which is likely to be high -presumably in the 2.5 - 4ohm region or higher, which puts the necessary enclosure size up again.
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Last edited by Scottmoose; 21st February 2015 at 12:00 PM.
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Old 21st February 2015, 11:25 PM   #10
chrisb is online now chrisb  Canada
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Well, here's a concept drawing of one that I built for a local guy - his design, and he quite loves them. I'm not such a huge fan of the driver myself - have heard them OB in a 3-way with JBL 2225* and Dayton AMT Pro4 tweeter, but not yet in this particular design. Not the tiniest of boxes, wider and approx same height / width as the SuperPensil for 12P, which if I had the space, I'd choose over the TB, or Fostex 206.

*now, that's a decent woofer, folks
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 1772 BLH.pdf (76.7 KB, 96 views)
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