12 inch full range SP-30PATC

[Elias]

Hi,

This 12" Monacor IMG Stage Line full range driver appears very interesting. Looks like very well built.

Any user experience ?

MONACOR INTERNATIONAL : SP-30PATC

 

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Looking good. It seems some design effort is spent in the edge of the whizzer cone. The frame reminds me of P-audio...

About 12" fullranger, remember Radugazon? In his big arrays, he uses 12" fullrangers, too.

Here is the spec. Nice bandwidth and sensitivity, proper Q for OB.

 

[talaerts]

Indeed an interesting speaker. Now, these PA things are designed for high efficiency rather than subtlety and detail. Still it would be fun to try building with it. I notice from a quick sim in WinISD that it will be difficult to get real bass with a bass reflex enclosure. Perhaps someone with access to Martin King's spreadsheets could try an MLTL for it?
The f-currve is quite ok, except for a dip at 3khz.

 

[Elias]

The frame reminds me of P-audio...

Yes I noticed the similatiry too. Anyway, it's cast metal and heavy, what could be better.

Here is the spec.

Is this 'ACR' the same conpany which was affiliated with Fostex in the 1980's

They had drivers like:

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.

(Image from Rudolf)


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[Elias]

Now, these PA things are designed for high efficiency rather than subtlety and detail.

How that can be seen from the specification ? What specification parameters correlate with 'subtlety' and 'detail' ?

I notice from a quick sim in WinISD that it will be difficult to get real bass with a bass reflex enclosure. Perhaps someone with access to Martin King's spreadsheets could try an MLTL for it?

I think a simple closed box placed against a wall will perform just well in a domestic living room. Boundary condition compensates for otherwise lowish Q.

The f-currve is quite ok, except for a dip at 3khz.

The dip at 3kHz is the BBC dip, of course !

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[woody]

Any idea about the cost ?

 

[IG81]

I agree on the P.Audio look-alike frame.

A couple of kHz too high for a proper BBC dip, but...

These things would do well in a Karlson IMO. It's the only pro 12" FR with a relatively low Qt I can think of. Good thing Fs is not suffering from it an up > 80Hz.

A recent thread about a Celestion driver with similar dustcap at the whizzer's edge had the poster remove it with subjective amelioration.

 

[talaerts]

How that can be seen from the specification ? What specification parameters correlate with 'subtlety' and 'detail' ?

It's a 400W PA speaker. In the specs. This kind of FR speaker is more likely used in a guitar amp, for example. Ultimate detail resolution is never a design criterium in such speakers.

I think it is safe to assume that a MarkAudio will sound more delicate and refined... but of course this beast may make up for it with a live kind of sensation.

I am interested to hear it.

 

[Elias]

Any idea about the cost ?

Looks like around 120€ (incl. taxes)

A couple of kHz too high for a proper BBC dip, but...

All the references I can remember indicate BBC dip to be at about 3kHz. Is that not proper ?

These things would do well in a Karlson IMO.

Karlson is the best solution for everything... Or that impression one gets when reading these forums

It's a 400W PA speaker. In the specs. This kind of FR speaker is more likely used in a guitar amp, for example. Ultimate detail resolution is never a design criterium in such speakers.

According to this theory, high power handling excludes 'ultimate detail resolution' ?

I think it is safe to assume that a MarkAudio will sound more delicate and refined... but of course this beast may make up for it with a live kind of sensation.

It is not meaningful to compare drivers of wastly different sizes.
I'm sure that if Mark Audio would make a 12 inch metal cone driver it would sound quite terrible


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[talaerts]

According to this theory, high power handling excludes 'ultimate detail resolution' ?

When you buy a TAD speaker component, yes then you can have both. But this is obviously not on TAD level.

 

[Elias]

Maybe Monacor SP-30PATC is the poor man's Goodmans Axiom 401


SP-30PATC vs. Axiom 401

http://www.crazy-speaker.de/stage-line-pa-breitbandlautsprecher-sp-30patc/

http://www.kogerer.ru/subj/ga401.html


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[xrk971]

Indeed, the sim appears to show that it can work quite well in an 0.87x scaled K15.

 

[GM]

URL="http://www.acrspeaker.com/productdetail.php?categ=K16&idproduct=18"]Here[/URL] is the spec.

Which specs are the correct ones?

The specs at the link are different from what’s on the .pdf.

GM

 

[Elias]

Few years ago in Klang & Ton there was project "wallter" using SP-30PATC. There was a tweeter but the cross over was very high about 10kHz.

Anyone ?

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.

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[Elias]

Why my link does not work, here is 'wallter'

 

[talaerts]

For those interested, plenty of info, measurements, plan, filter, description in German about Wallter can be found here:

Test Selbstbauprojekt - IMG Stageline K+T "Wallter" - Seite 1

It is in essence the complete Klang & Ton article.

Quite an interesting design for unobtrusive wall mounting.

EDIT: in a later published erratum, the BR pipe should be 13cm long.

 

[Elias]

Thanks talaerts, I had seen hifitest.de article but had forgotten it by now.

It is interesting that some dare to publish a speaker design in these modern days with 12" driver playing all the way above 10kHz


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[xrk971]

Can you get this driver in the US?

 

[talaerts]

Thanks talaerts, I had seen hifitest.de article but had forgotten it by now.

It is interesting that some dare to publish a speaker design in these modern days with 12" driver playing all the way above 10kHz


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I think it is quite a cool spacesaving design. They definitely recommend the tweeter in the sound description, it seems to sound a bit dark without it.
The two notch filters in the filter design will also come in useful if other enclosure types are tried out.

 

[$$Maan]

Anyone here heard about the sp-30pax? It's an earlier more powerful 600 w program driver. New diaphragms are easily found, but no info on the driver.

For me this alone is a good reason for NOT buing monacor / img / stageline, they throw away product information. So does other companies, doesn't make it any better... I sent them an email asking for the specs, no answers so far...