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need quick help with A10.3 info !
need quick help with A10.3 info !
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Old 26th September 2013, 03:36 PM   #41
lorienblack is offline lorienblack  United Kingdom
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Default Off axis?

So what sort of degree off axis are you eventually? My understanding was that 30degree off axis was a general starting point, so your at the 45degree point?
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Old 26th September 2013, 04:17 PM   #42
lorienblack is offline lorienblack  United Kingdom
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Just for laughs and giggles - I popped the backs of my 10.3m pensils, removed all the stuffing. The bass response had definitely improved volume wise, the sound in general terms feels more free, but for some reason the quality of sound stage has noticeably reduced with the speakers being much more noticeable as the emitting sources.

The more I listen the less I like it - stuffing at the ready.
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Old 26th September 2013, 05:03 PM   #43
Bob Brines is offline Bob Brines  United States
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Originally Posted by lorienblack View Post
So what sort of degree off axis are you eventually? My understanding was that 30degree off axis was a general starting point, so your at the 45degree point?
It depends.

For 2-ch, I sit at the apex if an 8'x8'x8' triangle. On axis is 30* from the wall. I toe in from there ~10*, so the speakers are toed ~40* from the wall.

For HT, the speakers are square with the wall. At the main listening position (my chair) the speakers are ~15* toed-out. Since I am somewhat off center, one speaker is louder than the other, which centers the image.

Bob
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Old 26th September 2013, 05:10 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Bigun View Post
Bob - thanks for sharing your experience, I agree, some toe-in does help but it means a restricted sweet-spot ? so you use any network parts, such as zobel in your build ?


Dave - good to know But the 10.2 is no longer in production is it ?

Chris - OK you dropped the bomb here - what A8 ?

A model proposed by Mark some time ago, and wistfully anticipated by some members of the club, but it was well back in the queue - IINM, the recent 2 revisions to the 10cm drivers were well underway before Mark's little set back.

As he's currently in the middle of a cross country trek (visiting the Wet Coast this coming weekend as a matter of fact) - he might not be able to immediately respond to the query.
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Old 26th September 2013, 05:22 PM   #45
Bigun is offline Bigun  Canada
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need quick help with A10.3 info !
Quote:
Originally Posted by lorienblack View Post
Just for laughs and giggles - I popped the backs of my 10.3m pensils, removed all the stuffing. The bass response had definitely improved volume wise, the sound in general terms feels more free, but for some reason the quality of sound stage has noticeably reduced with the speakers being much more noticeable as the emitting sources.

The more I listen the less I like it - stuffing at the ready.
Your description is very close to what I noticed. Funny you should mention, but I also found an impact on the imaging. I clearly noticed it but didn't give it much thought at the time because I had no rationale for why it would have changed. But I couldn't live with the 'dead bass' of the original level of stuffing. I guess a tradeoff has to be made and I think I found what I like by using half the stuffing I started out with, probably close to 0.3lb to 0.5lb/cu.ft. which is 1/3 of what the specifications called for.

Bob - for your own listening pleasure, when you apply mild DSP to the A10.3, how much correction are you applying - is it equivalent to around 3dB of BSC for example ?

And if your client wanted to have some BSC would you also apply a zobel to the A10.3 ?
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Last edited by Bigun; 26th September 2013 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 26th September 2013, 05:44 PM   #46
lorienblack is offline lorienblack  United Kingdom
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I just tried 400g, a little over half the amount, and stuffed a little less than the top half of the space. The bass remains about the same volume, imaging improves again.
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Old 26th September 2013, 05:45 PM   #47
Bob Brines is offline Bob Brines  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigun View Post
Bob - for your own listening pleasure, when you apply mild DSP to the A10.3, how much correction are you applying - is it equivalent to around 3dB of BSC for example ?
More like 3dB/octave below 100Hz. I also have a 48dB/octave high pass at 30Hz.

Quote:
And if your client wanted to have some BSC would you also apply a zobel to the A10.3 ?
No. a passive LR filter will do all that is necessary. Touch up with toe-in.

Bob
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Old 26th September 2013, 06:09 PM   #48
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
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need quick help with A10.3 info !
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigun View Post
But the 10.2 is no longer in production is it ?
Neither is the EL70.

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Old 26th September 2013, 09:25 PM   #49
lorienblack is offline lorienblack  United Kingdom
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Having just spent a couple of hours listening to my speakers, more lightly filled and bass improved, I am aware that the soundstage is still less that it was when they were filled close to the recommended amount.

Any of you boffins care to speculate why the soundstage is better the more filling there is? And - simple physics would indicate that the LF would be the least affected by the increased amount of fill, so why such a large drop off in LF when adding a few extra gm of filling?

And what was the design choice for filling them to such a point that the LF suffers?

Or perhaps seņor big un and myself are alone in these observations.
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Old 26th September 2013, 09:39 PM   #50
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
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need quick help with A10.3 info !
With less filling they will be peakier with ripple above & below the smoother level when more fill is used so some places will have more bass, and some less. Poorer imaging could be attributed to more time smeared information coming thru the back of the cone.

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