so, done deed - sort of. some might think that this belong in the three-way forum, but to me this is a full range with supportwheels. I also wish to thank everybody who has taken their time to answer questions from an obviously ignorant beginner. I do sometimes dive in head first without knowing whether the water is shallow or deep. and it is easy to think outside the box when you dont know neither the size nor the shape of said box. so, some pictures...
and a description with processhistory. after Building my B.I.B´s withe the Aucharm 4"´s that can be seen in the background on one of the Photos I couldnt keep from buying the Aucharm Diatone p610 clones. I was also intrigued by the concept of open baffle. however I knew that the combination fullrange single driver and open baffle wasnt the optimal combo as far as bassresponce was concerned. then I came across the SEAS A26re4. I learned two things; it had natural roll off and could be used without a XO (!) and it was the modern version of SEAS 25F-EW. and when I googled those woofers I found a pair for sale close to my adress...so...I also learned that the old SEAS woofers was in the Dynaco A25 speakers, and so I learned about aperiodic enclosures. to finish the Whole thing off, I had been looking at the Vifa XT25tg30 tweeters and the same day I fetched my woofers I found a pair of Scanspeak 83200 ( identical to the Vifas, but danishmade) for a real nice Price (cheaper than the Vifas)
so...I built this; in an aperiodic enclosure (with a Scanspeak resistive vent) of 33.3 liters I put the woofers firing downwards. on top of this an open baffle 34x84 cm of double mdf (2x19mm) the tweeter sits on the backpanel and the diatone on top of the front, so there is around 2 cm distance with the tweeter behind. both drivers are placed a little to the sides from the centerline ( off axis, if you want). the woofer and the full range are both naked, no crossover, no nothing. the tweeter has a 3.3uf cap and a 2ohm resistor in series and a zobel of 0.15uf and 3.6ohm. I have also added a 22 uf (disconnectable) to the tweeter so that there is a total of 25.3 uf ( close to the 26.5 uf that would give a high pass of 1500hz which is where the woofer rolls off. ( at first I intended to connect the woofer and tweeter in series but I had not undersood the first thing about series crossovers, you might say that the water was shallow there.
anyway, this is now all run in parallell. I have a biwireterminal on the boxes and I can run the full range alone, the woofer and tweeter alone, the whole thing together, I can disconnect the 22uf and I can disconnect the tweeter all together and run the woofer and fullrange ( with absolutely no components but the drivers. (minimalism, and by the way, my minimalism philosophy includes not spending more than necessary - the whole thing has costed just around $500). Right now I´m listening to the full monty (with tweeter and with the 22uf) and it sounds better than I deserve, my inexperience considered) I´m sure it could be tweaked to even better performerance and the aesthetics could be improved, but all in all...
speaking about tweaking, any suggestions enclosure or otherwise to improve SPL in a bass driver. and lastly - I´m in love with this diatoneclone and would really like to buy a bunch of them for different projects, including a Kondo-san inspired double bass-reflex.
I´ll stop ranting here...
and a description with processhistory. after Building my B.I.B´s withe the Aucharm 4"´s that can be seen in the background on one of the Photos I couldnt keep from buying the Aucharm Diatone p610 clones. I was also intrigued by the concept of open baffle. however I knew that the combination fullrange single driver and open baffle wasnt the optimal combo as far as bassresponce was concerned. then I came across the SEAS A26re4. I learned two things; it had natural roll off and could be used without a XO (!) and it was the modern version of SEAS 25F-EW. and when I googled those woofers I found a pair for sale close to my adress...so...I also learned that the old SEAS woofers was in the Dynaco A25 speakers, and so I learned about aperiodic enclosures. to finish the Whole thing off, I had been looking at the Vifa XT25tg30 tweeters and the same day I fetched my woofers I found a pair of Scanspeak 83200 ( identical to the Vifas, but danishmade) for a real nice Price (cheaper than the Vifas)
so...I built this; in an aperiodic enclosure (with a Scanspeak resistive vent) of 33.3 liters I put the woofers firing downwards. on top of this an open baffle 34x84 cm of double mdf (2x19mm) the tweeter sits on the backpanel and the diatone on top of the front, so there is around 2 cm distance with the tweeter behind. both drivers are placed a little to the sides from the centerline ( off axis, if you want). the woofer and the full range are both naked, no crossover, no nothing. the tweeter has a 3.3uf cap and a 2ohm resistor in series and a zobel of 0.15uf and 3.6ohm. I have also added a 22 uf (disconnectable) to the tweeter so that there is a total of 25.3 uf ( close to the 26.5 uf that would give a high pass of 1500hz which is where the woofer rolls off. ( at first I intended to connect the woofer and tweeter in series but I had not undersood the first thing about series crossovers, you might say that the water was shallow there.
anyway, this is now all run in parallell. I have a biwireterminal on the boxes and I can run the full range alone, the woofer and tweeter alone, the whole thing together, I can disconnect the 22uf and I can disconnect the tweeter all together and run the woofer and fullrange ( with absolutely no components but the drivers. (minimalism, and by the way, my minimalism philosophy includes not spending more than necessary - the whole thing has costed just around $500). Right now I´m listening to the full monty (with tweeter and with the 22uf) and it sounds better than I deserve, my inexperience considered) I´m sure it could be tweaked to even better performerance and the aesthetics could be improved, but all in all...
speaking about tweaking, any suggestions enclosure or otherwise to improve SPL in a bass driver. and lastly - I´m in love with this diatoneclone and would really like to buy a bunch of them for different projects, including a Kondo-san inspired double bass-reflex.
I´ll stop ranting here...
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Nice build! Congratulations on your OB project. 
I like the articulated 'Flat panel CRT style' mount for the OB on top of the bottom firing woofer. I like the minimalist approach of direct drive on woofer and full range with no cross-over. I was trying to develop a similar approach of the 'acoustic crossover' in an earlier thread to use a bandpass sub woofer enclosure to effect the crossover without resorting to putting anything in the electrical path. If you ever get some mic freq response measurements please post.
I like the articulated 'Flat panel CRT style' mount for the OB on top of the bottom firing woofer. I like the minimalist approach of direct drive on woofer and full range with no cross-over. I was trying to develop a similar approach of the 'acoustic crossover' in an earlier thread to use a bandpass sub woofer enclosure to effect the crossover without resorting to putting anything in the electrical path. If you ever get some mic freq response measurements please post.thanx. yeah, I really like this woofer for being able roll off itself without a xo. and in my head (though I really dont know much) the downward firing also constitutes some kind of "acoustic crossover". do you remember the name of the thread you´re mentioning. sounds interesting. not sure if I have chosen the optimal enclosure for the bass though. Í mean, it sounds great, but would something else be even better, smaller footprint? better efficiancy? but I did today, go to a store and listen to a B&W 802 and I must say, my creation holds it´s stand compared (not in powerhandling though...) and price concidered, that´s not a bad thing...
The acoustic cross over idea was something I discussed here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/230019-acoustical-cross-over-fast-budget.html
interesting concept, the 4th order box. the link to the article about different double chamber designs was very inspiring. I do run around with this idea in my head of a double bass reflex - maybe I´ll take that further...
and yes the drivers might be unneccessary high, being a newbie a steal ideas all over the place - I looked at all the Lukacz Fikus AKA The Lampizator´s projects, and he states the tweeter should be 1 meter from the ground. that might be his opinion only, I see other people do quite different things, so....
I did in fact think about sanding the edges down, but decided it was too much work. I dont have a workshop so I´m working on the floor of my appartments hallway with mostly handtools. But if I ever do a version 2.0 thats one of the things I would do - if not so for aestehic reasons. I do think that with this particular tweeter with its waveguidepeg, edgediffraction is not a major problem.
the diatoneclone is all you want, open, transparent, detailed with clarity, and I should say in this design with the full range having higher SPL than both the other drivers (the tweeter is also a bit attenuated with the 2 Ohm resistor) most of the character comes from the diatone ( obviously in this design, open baffle, far from the floor and the baffle not being that wide the bass is not mindblowing. it does though, have an Fs of 49hz which is not bad). - I really would like to try it on its own in a design aimed to support bass response. I might actually put them in my BIBs just to see
and yes the drivers might be unneccessary high, being a newbie a steal ideas all over the place - I looked at all the Lukacz Fikus AKA The Lampizator´s projects, and he states the tweeter should be 1 meter from the ground. that might be his opinion only, I see other people do quite different things, so....
I did in fact think about sanding the edges down, but decided it was too much work. I dont have a workshop so I´m working on the floor of my appartments hallway with mostly handtools. But if I ever do a version 2.0 thats one of the things I would do - if not so for aestehic reasons. I do think that with this particular tweeter with its waveguidepeg, edgediffraction is not a major problem.
the diatoneclone is all you want, open, transparent, detailed with clarity, and I should say in this design with the full range having higher SPL than both the other drivers (the tweeter is also a bit attenuated with the 2 Ohm resistor) most of the character comes from the diatone ( obviously in this design, open baffle, far from the floor and the baffle not being that wide the bass is not mindblowing. it does though, have an Fs of 49hz which is not bad). - I really would like to try it on its own in a design aimed to support bass response. I might actually put them in my BIBs just to see
that is, I must say, a very nice minimalistic series xo. origin? your own? and may I ask two ignorant (remember, I´m still a beginner - I´ve been at this for about two months) questions. what does it do in regards to an efficient mid-driver? and I seem to remember that my tweeter is a no ferro-fluid type - what does that mean, I mean why does it have to be a ferro-fluid tweeter in that series xo? but very interesting/simple concept
I stole it 
The crossover is 1st order so at resonance the tweeter may not find sufficient
'stopping' . I tried with a non FF tw too and it works ( it had good power handling, such as the Audax TW025 A16 ) but at high volume it starts to squeak . With this kind of driver arrangement I would suggest to put the woofer frontally , as usual ....
As for the midrange, I guess because it works by 'subtraction' from what the other drivers pick, electrically .
The crossover is 1st order so at resonance the tweeter may not find sufficient
'stopping' . I tried with a non FF tw too and it works ( it had good power handling, such as the Audax TW025 A16 ) but at high volume it starts to squeak . With this kind of driver arrangement I would suggest to put the woofer frontally , as usual ....
As for the midrange, I guess because it works by 'subtraction' from what the other drivers pick, electrically .
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bunkhokum, can you share with more impressions about Diatone 610 clone please?
May be you have some real measurements? Also it would be interesting to hear your option about Aucharm 4" speaker that can be seen on one of the pictures above, especially comparing with P610.
I'm interested in buying some fullrange from aliexpress and in need of some information.
May be you have some real measurements? Also it would be interesting to hear your option about Aucharm 4" speaker that can be seen on one of the pictures above, especially comparing with P610.
I'm interested in buying some fullrange from aliexpress and in need of some information.
I'm all about coming back to a thread with relevant information or updated information.
But, in this case, this thread was 4 years old, and the OP hasn't been seen around DIYA for over 2 years.
Chances are slim to get any more information.
Might have been better to start a new thread with what the poster had in mind in terms of a project with either the diatone clones, or the BIB.. but not together!
But, in this case, this thread was 4 years old, and the OP hasn't been seen around DIYA for over 2 years.
Chances are slim to get any more information.
Might have been better to start a new thread with what the poster had in mind in terms of a project with either the diatone clones, or the BIB.. but not together!
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