SpirosZ,
You have to remember that the Audax was really a proaudio speaker. I have used them, actually have horns that were designed to use that very speaker and they are great for what they are. This is a PA speaker and sounds like one. Great efficiency but not great sounding. I used these in proaudio monitors and they were fine for that application, but they were what they were.
You have to remember that the Audax was really a proaudio speaker. I have used them, actually have horns that were designed to use that very speaker and they are great for what they are. This is a PA speaker and sounds like one. Great efficiency but not great sounding. I used these in proaudio monitors and they were fine for that application, but they were what they were.
If high SPL's aren't required, the smaller Alpairs would work well, and you won't need a tweeter.
jeff
After reading all the reviews and discussions on the internet I am pretty convinced that the Eminence Legend B102 is the right driver for my needs.
On the Tekton Lore loudspeaker, it runs free with no filters and there is only a simple XO on the tweeter.
Couldn't be better.
tekton
Tekton Designs: Audiophile Success Despite All Odds
tekton design mini lore and lore.
AudiogoN Reviews: Tekton Design Lore
On the Tekton Lore loudspeaker, it runs free with no filters and there is only a simple XO on the tweeter.
Couldn't be better.
tekton
Tekton Designs: Audiophile Success Despite All Odds
tekton design mini lore and lore.
AudiogoN Reviews: Tekton Design Lore
Are you sure that they use a stock Eminence ? Because those things are designed to be very loud rather than very good. The stock model is designed for guitars, not for precisely rendering microdynamics. It wouldn't surprise me if the driver in the Tekton was modified, or a special order from Eminence.
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you have the pr170mo and you think they do not sound great?
they are known to be one of the best midrange of all time litterally. They compared against the very best PHL or Focal drivers.
I'm really curious to know more about your experience
To the op, please, dont trust my opinion because I dont have enough, but every experienced guy will tell you to stay away of bass drivers expecially for hifi for obvious reasons.
cheers
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I am sure the eminence are not hifi and I would never opt for this driver in particular.
Earlier Zu speakers used modified Eminence drivers. Perhaps they still do.
I heard the one with 4 woofers at the back and it was very musical.
However a bit of research made clear that using the stock driver wouldn't work so well.
Hence I wonder if Tekton also modifies the driver.
Reports indicate that the driver in the Tekton Lore is stock.
User reviews of that particular driver along with the FR chart confirm that it is a great extended range driver.
Other Tekton models maybe have modified drivers (Pendragon Tweeters are modified Scanspeak tweeters) but my guess is that this one is stock.
I know how it feels when something just breaks the rules and contrary to common believe behaves in an unexpected way.
A Bass Guitar driver? No way.
But having not heard the speaker to prove that it does not perform like a Hi Fi speaker and due to the lack of a single negative comment about it, I have to just take the word of all those people that actually heard it and couldn't believe their ears.
Believe me I searched the whole internet to find a single negative comment that would prove my superstition about pro drivers.
I even say this in one of my early posts in this thead.
Here is what I wrote in post #7:
"I also have the feeling that I have more chances to find what I want on a 6.5" than a 10" unless I raise the budget considerably.
And of course low cost pro speakers are simply out of question. The only pro speakers that I could ever listen to cost a few thousand dollars each (call me Nexo). "
Still, what I read convinced me I was wrong.
User reviews of that particular driver along with the FR chart confirm that it is a great extended range driver.
Other Tekton models maybe have modified drivers (Pendragon Tweeters are modified Scanspeak tweeters) but my guess is that this one is stock.
I know how it feels when something just breaks the rules and contrary to common believe behaves in an unexpected way.
A Bass Guitar driver? No way.
But having not heard the speaker to prove that it does not perform like a Hi Fi speaker and due to the lack of a single negative comment about it, I have to just take the word of all those people that actually heard it and couldn't believe their ears.
Believe me I searched the whole internet to find a single negative comment that would prove my superstition about pro drivers.
I even say this in one of my early posts in this thead.
Here is what I wrote in post #7:
"I also have the feeling that I have more chances to find what I want on a 6.5" than a 10" unless I raise the budget considerably.
And of course low cost pro speakers are simply out of question. The only pro speakers that I could ever listen to cost a few thousand dollars each (call me Nexo). "
Still, what I read convinced me I was wrong.
fair enough. I just really like the metal cones for their mids so maybe a larger metal cone with a tweet, fountek do a nice 6.5" at a good price http://www.fountek.net/uploadfile/1011/25104057.PDF
I was eyeballing that one too but then I discovered the 10" Eminence B102 and that is probably the driver I am looking for.
The center channel speaker is going to look enormous with that 10" driver but it's probably worth it.
There's nothing wrong with pro drivers for hifi sound. They're just very difficult to work with cause they have large break ups and wild impedance. I wouldn't be worried about the sound if you can implement it right. Mind you. The only eminence like this b102 was the beta12lta with a wizzer cone, and it had some issues. Not bad though. All the other eminence woofers I've used have been really great.
>>> Anyway, I already have a pair of 8" midbass drivers that I can try together with the CHP70s or the Tang Band W3-881SI that I also have.
>>> beta12lta...
The Eminence pro drivers are well built and if they suit your design they will sound great. I love the beta 12lta and have built my main system around them. I have a bunch of TB and Fostex drivers (including the expensive TB 1808 and Fostex 168Z) and prefer the Eminence overall for my application, in my room. I think the sound is so different between these drivers that personal taste must come into play. The larger pro drivers will sound very different than the smaller drivers listed above.
Just my 2 cents...
Zilla
>>> beta12lta...
The Eminence pro drivers are well built and if they suit your design they will sound great. I love the beta 12lta and have built my main system around them. I have a bunch of TB and Fostex drivers (including the expensive TB 1808 and Fostex 168Z) and prefer the Eminence overall for my application, in my room. I think the sound is so different between these drivers that personal taste must come into play. The larger pro drivers will sound very different than the smaller drivers listed above.
Just my 2 cents...
Zilla
this driver is worth a try
SP-205/8
Monacor SP 205 8 Universal Breitbandlautsprecher 8? | eBay
The best DIY speaker in the world? - DIY Audio & Electronics - StereoNET Australia
here are some pics from the original Australian Thread, because I think to see pictures you have to log in
Ultra Fi za male pare - Zvucnici - diyAudio.rs
for those who speaks German:
http://www.dosisnet.de/SP_205_8.pdf
SP-205/8
Monacor SP 205 8 Universal Breitbandlautsprecher 8? | eBay
The best DIY speaker in the world? - DIY Audio & Electronics - StereoNET Australia
here are some pics from the original Australian Thread, because I think to see pictures you have to log in
Ultra Fi za male pare
- Zvucnici - diyAudio.rsfor those who speaks German:
http://www.dosisnet.de/SP_205_8.pdf
I wonder, have you seen the frequency response graph of this driver?
I can't see any cone brake up (at least not one that can affect the sound). Can you? Am I missing something?
That was exactly my thought.
Personal taste plays a huge role here.
However in order to hear them I will have to buy them (just like I did with the CHP70s).
Oh well...
this driver is worth a try
SP-205/8
Monacor SP 205 8 Universal Breitbandlautsprecher 8? | eBay
The best DIY speaker in the world? - DIY Audio & Electronics - StereoNET Australia
here are some pics from the original Australian Thread, because I think to see pictures you have to log in
Ultra Fi za male pare
for those who speaks German:
http://www.dosisnet.de/SP_205_8.pdf
There are some ultra low cost drivers that are well worth a try, the monacor you just mentioned, the 6"Aura woofer, the 8" Kenford and probably several others I have not discover yet.
However even though I enjoy the DIY process I do not intend to keep building speakers as a hobby.
I just want to build the speakers I need and then sit back and enjoy them for years.
I truly hope i will only have to do it once
.
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I am not an expert but the cone break up (on the Eminence driver) at just above 2k looks very smooth and right after there is a very steep falloff so any harmonics will be very low in volume.
I have seen frequency graphs of other pro drivers that look like roller coasters above 1k but this one looks pretty smooth. My guess is that the cone breakup is not offensive and can be left as is.
The 3' driver looks quite smooth too at least up to 9k
I have seen frequency graphs of other pro drivers that look like roller coasters above 1k but this one looks pretty smooth. My guess is that the cone breakup is not offensive and can be left as is.
The 3' driver looks quite smooth too at least up to 9k
What I was saying, was directed at those who said pro drivers can't make hifi sound. Yes they can. They just get a bad name because they often require tons of work.
For this particular B102, I doubt the reviews your reading. I don't look at reviews like that because I like accurate sound and most reviewers like unaccurate sound. The B102 may have a smooth roll off, but what you don't see in the spec sheet, or my measurement of a 3" full ranger, is the harmonic distortion, the CSD ringing, the erratic off axis response, etc. That 3" has break up starting at 7khz and it's audible.
Your logic that because of the steep roll off any harmonics will be low in volume is incorrect. The harmonics originate lower in frequency than the break up. Here's a quick example: http://www.zaphaudio.com/temp/AurumCantus-AC200-50C2C-HD.gif
You can see the break up in the red plot starts at 3000hz and on. Look closely at the shape of the break up. Now look at the green trace (2nd order) directly below it. See it has the same shape. Now the blue (3rd order) starting at 1khz. And the grey (5th order) starting at 600hz. All those harmonics are products of the break up.
I'm only trying to be upfront. Your plan isn't necessarily bad. Go for it and report back to us. Godzilla seems to like the Beta 12LTA. Personally, I don't. But who am I to point to a graph and say he's wrong.
For this particular B102, I doubt the reviews your reading. I don't look at reviews like that because I like accurate sound and most reviewers like unaccurate sound. The B102 may have a smooth roll off, but what you don't see in the spec sheet, or my measurement of a 3" full ranger, is the harmonic distortion, the CSD ringing, the erratic off axis response, etc. That 3" has break up starting at 7khz and it's audible.
Your logic that because of the steep roll off any harmonics will be low in volume is incorrect. The harmonics originate lower in frequency than the break up. Here's a quick example: http://www.zaphaudio.com/temp/AurumCantus-AC200-50C2C-HD.gif
You can see the break up in the red plot starts at 3000hz and on. Look closely at the shape of the break up. Now look at the green trace (2nd order) directly below it. See it has the same shape. Now the blue (3rd order) starting at 1khz. And the grey (5th order) starting at 600hz. All those harmonics are products of the break up.
I'm only trying to be upfront. Your plan isn't necessarily bad. Go for it and report back to us. Godzilla seems to like the Beta 12LTA. Personally, I don't. But who am I to point to a graph and say he's wrong.
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