Hello guys, i'm new to diy and i'm researching my first speakers so i would like some guidelines:
- I want to make a pair of bookshelves which will be placed on stands on either side of my desk. The listening position will be sitting at the desk (working on the pc).
- The amp will be a T-amp, somewhere around 10w/c (already have it), source asus xonar stx from pc.
- The room is small, around 12'x9' (3.7mx2.9m). The speakers will be close to the wall about 1 feet, and the listening position in the center of the room about 4 feet from the speakers. Will add a room plan for better understanding.
- I want something easy to listen for lots of hours in a row, i listen to all types of music but mainly vocals, acoustic, jazz, classic rock.
- Atm i have 2 way 6.5'' 'regular' bass reflex speakers, aprox. 16l volume, but i could go bigger if needed, no WAF problems in here, it's my man cave
I read many threads the last 2 days and i find Mark Audio drivers appealing(but not sure about the sensitivity paired with my T-amp).. do you think it would ok for my needs? Alpair 7, 10 or 12? Or try something cheaper for my first project?
Also the variety of enclosures is confusing what would work best in my situation? (nearfield)
- I want to make a pair of bookshelves which will be placed on stands on either side of my desk. The listening position will be sitting at the desk (working on the pc).
- The amp will be a T-amp, somewhere around 10w/c (already have it), source asus xonar stx from pc.
- The room is small, around 12'x9' (3.7mx2.9m). The speakers will be close to the wall about 1 feet, and the listening position in the center of the room about 4 feet from the speakers. Will add a room plan for better understanding.
- I want something easy to listen for lots of hours in a row, i listen to all types of music but mainly vocals, acoustic, jazz, classic rock.
- Atm i have 2 way 6.5'' 'regular' bass reflex speakers, aprox. 16l volume, but i could go bigger if needed, no WAF problems in here, it's my man cave
I read many threads the last 2 days and i find Mark Audio drivers appealing(but not sure about the sensitivity paired with my T-amp).. do you think it would ok for my needs? Alpair 7, 10 or 12? Or try something cheaper for my first project?
Also the variety of enclosures is confusing
what would work best in my situation? (nearfield)Attachments
Hi,
The reduced BSC version of this should be good :
Zaph|Audio - ZMV5 - MCM / Vifa 5" System
rgds, sreten.
The reduced BSC version of this should be good :
Zaph|Audio - ZMV5 - MCM / Vifa 5" System
rgds, sreten.
I have a pair of Mark Audio CHP-70's on my desk at work. I use an old Sony receiver to power them. It's right around 18 WPC. I'd say you would probably be OK for nearfield listening with your amp. I'm a fan of Mark Audio speakers, so I'd say build a set and if your amp isn't powerful enough, get a larger one. I know that sounds bass-ackwards, but for bang for the buck, in my opinion you can't do much better. Depending on your budget, you could even go with 2 or more drivers per cabinet. That would give you a few more dB.
Sorry to spin the post around, but you mentioned Mark Audio, so it got my attention.
Mike
Sorry to spin the post around, but you mentioned Mark Audio, so it got my attention.
Mike
I listen to these all day long in a room about the same size as yours. Although made using some very inexpensive drivers the cabinet really makes it sound rich and full. They excel at vocals, acoustic stuff and jazz. They are wall mounts though, and from your picture it looks like you have wall space. They are indeed made using Logitech 'puter speakers You can build a slightly larger upgraded version with 3 in drivers that will be 16 in square.
Post 60 in this thread http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...building-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-6.html
Here is a 16 in version made with TB w3-881si drivers http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...uilding-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-41.html
You can build a slightly larger upgraded version with 3 in drivers that will be 16 in square.Post 60 in this thread http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...building-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-6.html
Here is a 16 in version made with TB w3-881si drivers http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...uilding-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-41.html
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That system looks like great value for the money and the reviews on the drivers seem very good but i want to try a fullrange speaker design. And i have zero experience with soldering so i try to avoid crossovers for now
The Asus Xonar Essence STX i'm using is pretty well regarded in terms of audio quality and my music is mainly ripped loseless format, so i would'n call that a problem, plus in the future i'm considering a dedicated DAC for the system
I really like the ideea of a "onken" cabinet but i would go with a bigger driver then the Fostex
I read about the CHP70, very well regarded but if budget will allow i think i'll try the Alpair 7.3 - it seems that lots of people are considering it one of the best fullrange speaker you can get.
I listen to these all day long in a room about the same size as yours. Although made using some very inexpensive drivers the cabinet really makes it sound rich and full. They excel at vocals, acoustic stuff and jazz. They are wall mounts though, and from your picture it looks like you have wall space. They are indeed made using Logitech 'puter speakers
Post 60 in this thread http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...building-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-6.html
Here is a 16 in version made with TB w3-881si drivers http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...uilding-cornu-spiral-horn-now-you-can-41.html
That is a very interesting design, looks easy to build but for the moment i want to make a standmount. But in the future I definitely see myself building two of this pizza boxes
Some more questions: if i settle on a Alpair 7.3(or something similar), what would be the differences between the BR cabinet and the onken style?
And another thing.. i never heard a fullrange speaker. Making some calculations the build will get me to around 3-400$. That's the price range for good quality commercial entry level bookshelves. How is a full range diy speaker(let's say based on the above Alpair 7.3) compared to these speakers? I know the sound signature is different, but a rough quantification of sound quality will put my mind to ease(as in a confirmation for getting better bang for the buck)
I'd say start out with a 2-way, but only use 3dB of baffle step compensation. Most designs on the internet use 6dB, and this is unlistenable when your speakers are near the wall. Vocals get drowned out by the bass. Using the right amount of BSC is the most critical aspect to the final sound of the entire system.
The Alpair 10.2 has 3dB of BSC already built in, which makes it easy, but it's on the expensive side.
The Alpair 10.2 has 3dB of BSC already built in, which makes it easy, but it's on the expensive side.
interesting! yes, also seemed expensive to me...
so, do you need "real" fullrangers or do you also have/plan a powered sub?
fullrangers have kind of a special sound, well, you'll get to know it then... they don't necessarily have to be expensive... there are also some "cheap" ones that are really "good", imho
with pc as source, you can also use a software EQ for the BSC... as well as for some maybe needed notch filter(s)
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I personally have a sub but don't use it. Bass extension with an Alpair 10.2 is pretty good in a small room, and the bass is clean and punchy. The room reflections add bass, that's why it sounds better with the subwoofers turned off. But I did add a tweeter. I like to hear the sparkle of instruments.
Bottom line for bocosb is, pick a 5.25" woofer in a 2-way, with 3dB to 4dB of BSC. Be prepared to spend $$$ on the crossover. Some newbies only take into account the cost of the drivers, which is just a small part of the expense.
I'd say this is true for the larger fullrange units (especially when driven by SET amps) but the 3" and 4" ones to me just sound like a conventional 2-way but with the frequency extremes cut off. The smaller fullrange units don't have the dynamics, the warmth, or the expansive soundstage of the larger units.
so... the t-amp is a nice small amlifier, yet it cannot deliver a lot of power-output. This might be a problem, when you want to listen "loud". So it would be a good idea to find some efficient speakers (be it fullrange or two-way, that is a matter of taste...). Fullrangers are easier to construct, normally (and this way suited for a first project)... When you have the possibility to filter via EQ on your PC, even better, then you can save the money for BSC and/or notch-filters...
do you like to listen to your music loud?
do you like to listen to your music loud?
I usually listen to low-medium levels.. i'd say under 70db for the majority of time and sometimes up to 80-84db (but that's rare) - this values are measured with an android app, probably not very precise.
My t-amp is hooked on 88db two way speakers and with the volume in windows on 100% i'm not going past 12'clock ever.
Now, the sensitivity of the driver wouldn't influence the sound quality too when hooked to a low power amp? or just the volume?
My t-amp is hooked on 88db two way speakers and with the volume in windows on 100% i'm not going past 12'clock ever.
Now, the sensitivity of the driver wouldn't influence the sound quality too when hooked to a low power amp? or just the volume?
well, yes and no. When the speaker has a higher efficiency, the whole system will go louder with less distortion. On low listening levels it won't account much. But afterall the t-amp is "weak". When you combine it with really efficient speakers, it's stunning
ok, some suggestions, I will only suggest what I already heard, and these should not be overpriced, I hope...
3" fullrange drivers: Visaton FRS8 (cheap and good, smooth FR), Tangband W3-871S (there are some constructions out there using these drivers, they both can not go loud!)
4" fullrange driver: Fostex FE103E (without the "n", probably very similar, a quite "revealing" driver) ~6L BR (I was using these a long time with the sonic aimpact...)
6" fullrange driver: Fostex FE167E (I have one little notch filter for it) ~15L BR
these small fullrangers can not produce a lot of bass, so either, one could add a "cheap" powered sub, or pick a larger unit, but if you're used to two/three way systems, the "beaming" / dispersion patterns are different
since you don't have to go really loud, you might pick a small one... I would have a tendency towards the FE103E
, but that's just my taste... (and then I would spend the saved $$ on a cheap 8"/10" sub and plate amp)in your shown listening room, the speakers are near the wall, that's good for helping them with the bass, so for a first try, you could go without the sub. When you want more lowrange one day you can quickly build one
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In answer to your question about a full-range DIY build vs commercial HiFi stuff...
The commercial stuff doesn't stand a chance. Seriously. (in a £1000 speaker, around 10% goes toward the drive units)
Studio monitors, however, are a bit of a different story. IMHO, Behringer's Truth line is very difficult to beat for the money, and have amplifiers (including room-related eq) built-in. For a £300 pair, more like 50% would be drive units (if you bought them).
It all depends on what you're after:
If its a nice introduction to DIY, a FR driver in a decent cabinet is a good starting point
If its a one-off build, then I'd try to find somewhere to listen to some Behringer B2030As (the others I've heard are good, but price/performance, these are exceptional).
HTH
Chris
The commercial stuff doesn't stand a chance. Seriously. (in a £1000 speaker, around 10% goes toward the drive units)
Studio monitors, however, are a bit of a different story. IMHO, Behringer's Truth line is very difficult to beat for the money, and have amplifiers (including room-related eq) built-in. For a £300 pair, more like 50% would be drive units (if you bought them).
It all depends on what you're after:
If its a nice introduction to DIY, a FR driver in a decent cabinet is a good starting point
If its a one-off build, then I'd try to find somewhere to listen to some Behringer B2030As (the others I've heard are good, but price/performance, these are exceptional).
HTH
Chris
I had to leave the country for few weeks so i'll probably start the project at the end of february/beginning of march; thx for the replies so far
By any chance, does anybody knows some dealers/shops in Dubai where i could audition full range speakers? Where i live this possibility in non-existent and i have some spare time during my stay.
By any chance, does anybody knows some dealers/shops in Dubai where i could audition full range speakers? Where i live this possibility in non-existent and i have some spare time during my stay.
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