BMR 4.5 inch Neo efficiency
Hi XRK971
In the real word ( not smoothed manufactures data) the 4.5 inch Neo is 89 dB to 90dB over a broad range of about 130Hz to 10Khz.
It rolls off fairly smoothly below Fs 105Hz ( plus minus about 5% tolerances)
It has a bit of a narrow spike at 8,500 to 9,500 Khz and rolls off quite quickly above 12KHz.
I use Eq to compensate, as as the off axis is so fab and even Eq really works a treat without introducing any off axis peaks and troughs.
I hope other guys try this driver, esp your " flat on wall horn"!!
Cheers
Derek.
Hi XRK971
In the real word ( not smoothed manufactures data) the 4.5 inch Neo is 89 dB to 90dB over a broad range of about 130Hz to 10Khz.
It rolls off fairly smoothly below Fs 105Hz ( plus minus about 5% tolerances)
It has a bit of a narrow spike at 8,500 to 9,500 Khz and rolls off quite quickly above 12KHz.
I use Eq to compensate, as as the off axis is so fab and even Eq really works a treat without introducing any off axis peaks and troughs.
I hope other guys try this driver, esp your " flat on wall horn"!!
Cheers
Derek.
LG - 6400WTTCO3A. I don't think you can buy them other than in a completed speaker. They came with a 3" PR in the box. Dumb design but nice driver.
Only because of the midrange and up. They can't compete with the bass of the 125.
Don't get me wrong. I have been very impressed with the Mark Audio stuff but I only own the EL70 and I find that a little confined in the top end. Some people think they are the cat's meow and I won't argue. I just need a little more on top to keep my ears happy.
I only own the Jordan 6T so I can't say that's a fair comparison. I can tell you that it's not my cup of tea. They sound coloured to my ears.
For the last however many years, I've thought of it as a Sansui but looking at the pic...it's also one of the salvaged drivers so you wouldn't be able to buy it off the shelf. Really nice all around driver though. I think I like it more than the RS1354.
See the pic. Maybe you guys can sort out what it actually is. It's at the other place so I can't go look at it right now. Inverted rubber surround and plastic dust cap.
Attachments
Alpair 7.3eN closely followed by FF85wKeN, with the latter bass assistance is really needed.
dave
There is only one way to find out, buy them and listen! In all fairness to manufacturers if they showed real world frequency graphs no one would buy there products!
A question to CastleJohn, has this thread gotten you any closer to an answer to your original question? Or helped you make a decision on which driver to purchase?
Larry
A question to CastleJohn, has this thread gotten you any closer to an answer to your original question? Or helped you make a decision on which driver to purchase?
Larry
Well I'm not sure about that, Larry. It looks like if I want the smoothest mids & highs then I need to look at something like planet 10's MA Alpair 7.3eN ($290/pair). But I wonder whether they'll fill out the bass sufficiently without building massive horns for them. I would ideally like to just stick them in a straightforward ported box, or possibly a TL. And then there is the EAD E100 or E100HD ($330 or $360/pair). I'd love to hear from someone who has heard both, and is into classical music, both recorded and live.
That would sound great! That's what's called a FAST around here. See this thread: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/144099-thread-tysen-variations-fast.html
And I just started this thread to discuss more about woofers and cross overs specific to this design approach: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/227834-cross-over-design-woofer-choices-fast.html
And I just started this thread to discuss more about woofers and cross overs specific to this design approach: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/227834-cross-over-design-woofer-choices-fast.html
I want the very best mid/top end possible, within a few hundred dollars. I agree the benefit of Enabling is doubtful (after all, you can spend $1000 on a kettle lead if you want to). Furthermore, metal cones fill me with intrepidation. Which probably sways me more towards the Jordan JX92S (EAD E100HD).
The reason i gave away (sold really cheap) both of the EAD era JX92 pairs was because of a very annoying HF characteristic. The Alpair 7.3 (even stock) ismuch better balanced & has higher DDR. EnABLing takes an already good driver even further, improved DDR in aprticular noticable right away with a bigger, deeper soundstage...
The Alpair 10.2 is actually the direct size competitor with the JX92, on sales in Silver at Madisound for $160/pr. For about half the price, you get a better driver in both cases.
Jim, is your take on EnABL based on actual experience?
dave
CastleJohn if your worried about the bass on the MA 10.2 driver DON"T BE!! This speakers betters more than a few dedicated woofers the same size. I just purchased another pair on sale at Madisound because this is the BEST DEAL in AUDIO today! For a simple single driver no filter required set up they are very hard to beat!
Larry
Larry
Planet 10,
Listening tests. In Ed LaFountaine's mini-monitor test pairs--one pair with and one pair without Enabled drivers--I did not think that Enabling gave significant improvement to the sound. My opinion is that listeners would be better served by using a better driver or by using a bass driver implementation (aka FAST) to supplement the overall sound. More bang for my bucks.
Jim
Listening tests. In Ed LaFountaine's mini-monitor test pairs--one pair with and one pair without Enabled drivers--I did not think that Enabling gave significant improvement to the sound. My opinion is that listeners would be better served by using a better driver or by using a bass driver implementation (aka FAST) to supplement the overall sound. More bang for my bucks.
Jim
Where your hearing stops, IMO, is not really relevant.
The Alpair 10.2 is very good in the top. Just don't listen to the Alpair 7.3 right after. You'll be torn because you now know what is missing. Or like Ryan decide right there & then that A7.3 is more appropriate & (maybe) plan on a helper woofer to bring the system to a point where all those things the A10.2 does better. Same probably applies to FF85wk which is hard to get away without a woofer.
dave
Really only applicable to you personally.
I had 2 pair of sensitivity matched mMar-Kel70, one set treated, one not. Let's say half (probably slightly over) could clearly hear a difference (blind) and the rest weren't all that sure. If you listen to gross information (flatness of the reponse etc, you likely will miss the differences (or your ear/brain has not had sufficient training to even hear), the differences are primamrily low level. With a track that has the kind of information that EnABL allows out of the mud, i can personally pick out the EnABLed pair blind within a flip or 2 of the AB switch.
Those that can get EnABLed drivers, those that can't should save their money and buy more music.
dave
Dave,
Yes, you can hear differences. My judgment was based upon whether the sound was significantly improved between with or without Enable. That is where my recommendations--better driver, bass improvement, etc. come as in my mind the cost of hand treating does not merit consideration.
If Enable was the cat meow, then large manufacturers would be leading the parade to have their drivers treated. Very little efficacy data has been presented so far to show any benefit. Plus the lack of a coherent technical explanation of what the Enable mechanism really does bothers me. Remember I am objective minded soul so subjective B.S. doesn't work with me.
Jim
Yes, you can hear differences. My judgment was based upon whether the sound was significantly improved between with or without Enable. That is where my recommendations--better driver, bass improvement, etc. come as in my mind the cost of hand treating does not merit consideration.
If Enable was the cat meow, then large manufacturers would be leading the parade to have their drivers treated. Very little efficacy data has been presented so far to show any benefit. Plus the lack of a coherent technical explanation of what the Enable mechanism really does bothers me. Remember I am objective minded soul so subjective B.S. doesn't work with me.
Jim
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Lets get back to the original question, adding a tweeter or a woofer makes it a Multi-Way speaker with all it's added complexities. Expecting a single driver to be the do-all and end-all is a TALL order! I think the MA 10.2 does a very respectable job of balancing all the trade-offs without giving up too much in any department. It goes high, it goes low, and the middle is non to shabby. Find another driver that can do all that!
Is it the best?
Larry
Is it the best?
Larry
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