3" FR + 6" woofer - beginner - help - Page 2

wintermute · 12th November 2012, 01:39 AM

My position would be that if you want to get the best sound out of the drivers you will probably need to measure, simulate build and possibly tweak.

However having lived with a set of speakers for 20 years (that I was perfectly happy with) that I used off the shelf crossovers (a couple of different ones till I got something I was happy with) and multiple different drivers over that time as well, I would say that it is definitely possible to get something good without doing the measurements.

Everyone's definition of good is different, and for me good was better than everyone else I knew who had consumer audio. It wasn't until I listened to some truly high end stuff that I realised how lacking it still was.

As you said you wanted to learn something, I think the best thing to do is experiment and see how you go. I think that all of the playing I did in the early years helped me when I finally started to measure and design in a more engineering fashion.

Even something as simple as a computer microphone (even one on a webcam) with some free software like holm impulse, can give some visual feedback to what you are hearing and help you to understand what is going on.

The way to approach it is not to worry whether or not it is a success or a failure sonically, but whether you learn something or not. Even if sonically it is a failure, if you learn something from that, then in my books it is a success

Tony.

planet10 · 12th November 2012, 02:09 AM

Here is a link to something akin to what you are trying to do...

dave

TFG1067 · 13th November 2012, 06:49 PM

I agree Tony, thanks for your input!

Dave, I think your link is missing. Unless you meant the links in your signature, which are quite impressive. When I have more time I really want to make one of those miniOnken. Beautiful design

chrisb · 13th November 2012, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TFG1067

I agree Tony, thanks for your input!

Dave, I think your link is missing. Unless you meant the links in your signature, which are quite impressive. When I have more time I really want to make one of those miniOnken. Beautiful design

yes, he has been known to paste a blank field, or words to that effect.

von.ah · 13th November 2012, 07:30 PM

I'm in the nascent stage of building something very similar to you,TFG... I like the term fiddlefarting.

I have some of the same TBs and another buyout special from PE (the 299-114 woofer) that I am adapting an old pair of ~ 12L two-way cabinets with. At the moment I'm playing with ideas for the internal compartment which will house the W3881si. 4" PVC couplers and caps are the leading scheme... I move at a glacial rate on audio projects, so you're likely to finish before me.

Bob Richards · 14th November 2012, 04:13 AM

The trouble with passive crossovers is that they need to take into account the impedance of the drivers at the crossover frequency, which is often substantially different than the published "nominal" rating (8 ohms for example). You also need to measure and adjust for different sensitivities. One driver may give 5-10 dB more output than the other. Having said that, being off a bunch isn't usually horrible. Many of my early speaker projects were very sloppy, and still pretty enjoyable. Down the road you might decide to get a calibrated mic and look at the acoustic output of each driver separately, and see how to improve the accuracy.

planet10 · 14th November 2012, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TFG1067

Dave, I think your link is missing.

A thread for Tysen and variations on FAST

Oops

planet10 · 14th November 2012, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by von.ah

4" PVC couplers and caps are the leading scheme...

Forget the caps, just run it out the back and damp till aperiodic.

dave

von.ah · 15th November 2012, 07:54 PM

I will probably go with that, Dave.
However, I just stumbled on this idea... What about using some of these foam baffles used for auto speakers? A lot less volume, but a lot easier to work with.

XTC 4" Round Foam Baffle Pair 260-782

planet10 · 15th November 2012, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by von.ah

I will probably go with that, Dave.
However, I just stumbled on this idea... What about using some of these foam baffles used for auto speakers? A lot less volume, but a lot easier to work with.

If you are happy with the mid-tweeter sealed, i'd suggest a visit to the local dollar store and quest for an appropriately shaped piece of plastic kitchenware.

dave

12th November 2012, 01:39 AM	#11
wintermute just another diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Sydney Blog Entries: 22	My position would be that if you want to get the best sound out of the drivers you will probably need to measure, simulate build and possibly tweak. However having lived with a set of speakers for 20 years (that I was perfectly happy with) that I used off the shelf crossovers (a couple of different ones till I got something I was happy with) and multiple different drivers over that time as well, I would say that it is definitely possible to get something good without doing the measurements. Everyone's definition of good is different, and for me good was better than everyone else I knew who had consumer audio. It wasn't until I listened to some truly high end stuff that I realised how lacking it still was. As you said you wanted to learn something, I think the best thing to do is experiment and see how you go. I think that all of the playing I did in the early years helped me when I finally started to measure and design in a more engineering fashion. Even something as simple as a computer microphone (even one on a webcam) with some free software like holm impulse, can give some visual feedback to what you are hearing and help you to understand what is going on. The way to approach it is not to worry whether or not it is a success or a failure sonically, but whether you learn something or not. Even if sonically it is a failure, if you learn something from that, then in my books it is a success Tony. __________________ Any intelligence I may appear to have is purely artificial! Some of my photos

12th November 2012, 02:09 AM	#12
planet10 frugal-phile(tm) diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III Blog Entries: 5	Here is a link to something akin to what you are trying to do... dave __________________ community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi p10-hifi forum here at diyA

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13th November 2012, 06:49 PM	#13
TFG1067 diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: CA	I agree Tony, thanks for your input! Dave, I think your link is missing. Unless you meant the links in your signature, which are quite impressive. When I have more time I really want to make one of those miniOnken. Beautiful design

13th November 2012, 07:30 PM	#15
von.ah diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Maryland, USA	I'm in the nascent stage of building something very similar to you,TFG... I like the term fiddlefarting. I have some of the same TBs and another buyout special from PE (the 299-114 woofer) that I am adapting an old pair of ~ 12L two-way cabinets with. At the moment I'm playing with ideas for the internal compartment which will house the W3881si. 4" PVC couplers and caps are the leading scheme... I move at a glacial rate on audio projects, so you're likely to finish before me.

14th November 2012, 04:13 AM	#16
Bob Richards diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Portland Oregon, USA	The trouble with passive crossovers is that they need to take into account the impedance of the drivers at the crossover frequency, which is often substantially different than the published "nominal" rating (8 ohms for example). You also need to measure and adjust for different sensitivities. One driver may give 5-10 dB more output than the other. Having said that, being off a bunch isn't usually horrible. Many of my early speaker projects were very sloppy, and still pretty enjoyable. Down the road you might decide to get a calibrated mic and look at the acoustic output of each driver separately, and see how to improve the accuracy.