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Old 12th November 2012, 07:24 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppaz View Post
My situation is I would like to run a full range speaker front 3 for clarity and a seamless transition.
Same here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoppaz View Post
At the moment I can find some localisation from the m&ks (despite room eq) so was looking at the full range option. Localisation being a lack of seamless integration at the front.
In my case, I can't locate the individual speakers unless I turn off the center channel, and then it sounds as though the sound is all coming from the left speaker (I sit toward the left side of the room typically). Basically the center channel anchors the dialog and FX on the screen for all viewers, and the LR fill in the music swells as it should be. I have issues understanding what the actors are saying (many do not enunciate) but the soundfield is fantastic. I assume you have tried it with the receiver DSP turned off.

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Originally Posted by hoppaz View Post
My problems are I am limited to the height and width they can be located. I only ever use my processor which has active filtering so I don't need a complex speaker design with passive xo's. Simpler the better as far I am concerned.
Same here, but I suspect I could get away with bigger speakers than you could if I really wanted to. .......If I were willing to settle for a horizontal center channel cabinet. Theoretically, I could build two slim floor standers 38" high by 14" deep and a center channel 10" by 60" long. But I don't want to do that because I think the 'best' voice matching is attained if the cabinets and drivers are all the same. That's why I'm thinking of building three max 10" (25 cm) high "satellites." I came up with that number because that's the size monitor that would fit beneath the projection screen at the moment.

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Originally Posted by hoppaz View Post
I was looking to hit 80hz but 9 and 10 liters are big speakers for the average UK sized living room. Is there any disadvantage to go to 100hz? If not what sort of sealed/ported size would be required for both the 7s and 10s?
Go ahead and set your sub xover to 100Hz and see what you think. I've tried 100 Hz and can't localize the sound. However, I'm considering 150 Hz for the sats I plan to build, and expect to be able to localize the sub a bit at that frequency, which I am willing to live with. I have modeled the A7.3 and it works fine in a small 2 liter sealed box, but it is down 3dB at 100Hz. In a 6.4 L sealed box, the A7.3 is down 2.5 dB at 100 Hz. So, in sealed boxes, size does not seem to matter much. In either case, crossing at 120-150 Hz would probably be best with a sealed alignment. According to the models, A7 would hit 100Hz easily in a 5 L ported box tuned to 60 Hz. The question then becomes whether it would have the power handling to actually handle that frequency at volume. I suspect it would handle up to 90 dB though, which would be very loud in small rooms.

See Dave's post in this thread for some plans for A6M (the 3" metal cone Alpair driver) and related discussion as well... Compact Enclosures for Alpair 6M

Last edited by Ben_Tech; 12th November 2012 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 12th November 2012, 07:43 PM   #92
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Please bear in mind that this is my opinion, and only that, but i would go sealed with either Alpair, and take the hit in extension.
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Old 12th November 2012, 07:50 PM   #93
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The CHR-70 looks good for value and the A6P looks good for matching with inexpensive electronics and compressed source material as well. At least according to the resident experts. So those would be two more considerations for anyone following this thread.
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Old 12th November 2012, 07:52 PM   #94
hoppaz is offline hoppaz  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben_Tech View Post
Same here.



In my case, I can't locate the individual speakers unless I turn off the center channel, and then it sounds as though the sound is all coming from the left speaker (I sit toward the left side of the room typically). Basically the center channel anchors the dialog and FX on the screen for all viewers, and the LR fill in the music swells as it should be. I have issues understanding what the actors are saying (many do not enunciate) but the soundfield is fantastic. I assume you have tried it with the receiver DSP turned off.



Same here, but I suspect I could get away with bigger speakers than you could if I really wanted to. .......If I were willing to settle for a horizontal center channel cabinet. Theoretically, I could build two slim floor standers 38" high by 14" deep and a center channel 10" by 60" long. But I don't want to do that because I think the 'best' voice matching is attained if the cabinets and drivers are all the same. That's why I'm thinking of building three max 10" (25 cm) high "satellites." I came up with that number because that's the size monitor that would fit beneath the projection screen at the moment.



Go ahead and set your sub xover to 100Hz and see what you think. I've tried 100 Hz and can't localize the sound. However, I'm considering 150 Hz for the sats I plan to build, and expect to be able to localize the sub a bit at that frequency, which I am willing to live with. I have modeled the A7.3 and it works fine in a small 2 liter sealed box, but it is down 3dB at 100Hz. In a 6.4 L sealed box, the A7.3 is down 2.5 dB at 100 Hz. So, in sealed boxes, size does not seem to matter much. In either case, crossing at 120-150 Hz would probably be best with a sealed alignment. According to the models, A7 would hit 100Hz easily in a 5 L ported box tuned to 60 Hz. The question then becomes whether it would have the power handling to actually handle that frequency at volume. I suspect it would handle up to 90 dB though, which would be very loud in small rooms.

See Dave's post in this thread for some plans for A6M (the 3" metal cone Alpair driver) and related discussion as well... Compact Enclosures for Alpair 6M
I have tried no dsp but the emotiva is very good at room eq using all of the speakers incl. The sub so I want to stick with that. My rears are m and k tripoles and I cross over at 100hz currently. All front three are upstanders and I like the idea of a full rangers but without a passive xo. The idea is the simpler the system, the simpler it will be on a auto room eq set up.

The 7.3s seem a preferred option.
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Old 13th November 2012, 02:02 PM   #95
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For a seemless front, run the exact same speakers for left, center, and right.

It helped when rears matched also.
No longer did the surround modes sound like they were in a tin can.

For home theater, I'd go with 6.5" or even audio nirvana cast 8's.
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