Well, I'm certainly not dismissing them. Looks to be an interesting unit, I'll see what I can come up with in cabinet terms when I get chance (& the final production specs. are out).
Be interesting to see how they're priced. UK built generally = £. Add 'Lowther' into that and that probably = ££. Fair enough. That frame looks rather like those of the C45; wonder if they've used that as the basis. Presumably Lowther have brought their speciality in motor design to play & helped Ted to realise some of his concepts. Good combination anyway. The phase plug design is interesting. Judging from the picture, reminds me a little of the one Decware use in their modified FE206E.
OT, re the 'crumbling cones' point made about the Alpair 10, I believe you might be thinking of the original model, which used a very soft alloy for the cone, and when driven to excess, could be deformed. You did need mechanical sympathy roughly equivalent to Captain Caveman to do this though. No problems to report from my pair, which still get some use.
Be interesting to see how they're priced. UK built generally = £. Add 'Lowther' into that and that probably = ££. Fair enough. That frame looks rather like those of the C45; wonder if they've used that as the basis. Presumably Lowther have brought their speciality in motor design to play & helped Ted to realise some of his concepts. Good combination anyway. The phase plug design is interesting. Judging from the picture, reminds me a little of the one Decware use in their modified FE206E.
OT, re the 'crumbling cones' point made about the Alpair 10, I believe you might be thinking of the original model, which used a very soft alloy for the cone, and when driven to excess, could be deformed. You did need mechanical sympathy roughly equivalent to Captain Caveman to do this though. No problems to report from my pair, which still get some use.
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...I was at a Patti Smith concert. It tends to affect your mind.
That and all the beer?
dave
funny how any mention of Jordan and immediately the knives are out! yes there does seem to be a little bias on this site due to commercial interests.
I like all the MA drivers I have heard, especially the latest Chr 70. For all the tweaking and advances, sometimes the original brew is spot on, and for what its worth I prefer the sound of the previous Alpair 6 over the new one.
I like all the MA drivers I have heard, especially the latest Chr 70. For all the tweaking and advances, sometimes the original brew is spot on, and for what its worth I prefer the sound of the previous Alpair 6 over the new one.
Saying what i was thinking Bill. I have the Alpair 6 original, and its so-so. Between Bandor, Mark Audio and Jordan there isnt much to choose between IMO. Id choose based on specs and price, like many. This new jordan has a Qts and Fs which would suit my goals almost perfectly, unlike the MA stuff im aware of.
Vb at Vas, F3 at Fs, should be a doddle.
Vb at Vas, F3 at Fs, should be a doddle.
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Which knives are those?
One person who doesn't generally care for FR units anyway reflects that thus far there isn't anything in the preliminary data that gets him thinking it's a big improvement over the original. Fair enough, he's entitled to express his opinion. And another person points out, quite correctly, that the new unit really does need to show a significant improvement over the original, since the competition is greater now than when the JX92 was first introduced, and in many ways, they have been surpassed. Fair point. Note that said person has also stated he'll be buying a pair. Is this supposed to be anti-Jordan? Or is everyone just supposed to bow down & worship?
One person who doesn't generally care for FR units anyway reflects that thus far there isn't anything in the preliminary data that gets him thinking it's a big improvement over the original. Fair enough, he's entitled to express his opinion. And another person points out, quite correctly, that the new unit really does need to show a significant improvement over the original, since the competition is greater now than when the JX92 was first introduced, and in many ways, they have been surpassed. Fair point. Note that said person has also stated he'll be buying a pair. Is this supposed to be anti-Jordan? Or is everyone just supposed to bow down & worship?
Mondo, the Bandors are my favorite sounding small metal cone drivers. They just sound lush and 'right'. Talking to Doreen last yr, she revealed a couple of her trade secrets to me, really fascinating.
Liking the look of this new Jordan tho, its v Terminator
Hope the production ones have less of a 'spike' at 9khz (partly due to the rather odd shaped roll surround?). Seeing as its basically a new driver rather than an upgrade, It wd have been interesting if the cone was very slightly smaller to improve the treble response. Just my opinion.
Liking the look of this new Jordan tho, its v Terminator
Hope the production ones have less of a 'spike' at 9khz (partly due to the rather odd shaped roll surround?). Seeing as its basically a new driver rather than an upgrade, It wd have been interesting if the cone was very slightly smaller to improve the treble response. Just my opinion.
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i think that the reference to knives was in relation to the opinion in some circles, and not directed at you Scottmoose. The most important factor to me is use-ability. If the proto specs are what is to be expected in the production driver, then it suits my goals far better than the MA drivers that im familiar with. A slightly inflated price over the MAs, would be worth it in that situation. I cant recall details but perhaps the Bandor would also suit, IF theyre still being sold.
I think the Bandor units are, but their wideband drivers (or at least the ones with HF output) are smaller than the ones in question here. I suspect they're produced in small batches though, so availablity may be patchy. One way to find out though & that's to ask them.
I'm not too worried about the price on the Jordan drivers; it's speculative anyway at present, although I doubt they'll be cheap. Quality costs, especially if UK manufacture is involved, which is fair enough.
I'm not too worried about the price on the Jordan drivers; it's speculative anyway at present, although I doubt they'll be cheap. Quality costs, especially if UK manufacture is involved, which is fair enough.
Scott: yes, the Bandor 50, and 150. These i likened to A6 and A10, and their Jordan counterparts. I have to confess, my intended use for any of those drivers would be widerange rather than fullrange, so you are correct about the Bandors. This new Jordan looks like a good alternative to the Bandor150, for me at least. I expect id use these as I would the A10BW.
Bill: Part of me wishes id bought the Bandor50 for midtweeter duties, instead, or as well as the Alpair6s.
Bill: Part of me wishes id bought the Bandor50 for midtweeter duties, instead, or as well as the Alpair6s.
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A10BW?
Right, although the 50 is about 30% smaller than the Alpair 6P/M, and the 150 is nearly 250% larger than the Alpair 10.2, so we're not really comparing like with like. Nice drivers though, the Bandors. Agreed, & less than nothing wrong with running wideband with support. My current favourite unit for midtweet duties is the FF85wk (same as Dave), which is roughly the same size as the Bandor 50. Not much to choose between any of the 50mm Bandors & the Fostex in terms of measured response (i.e. they're all extremely good); the latter is a bit cheaper & easier to get hold of for a lot of people though.
Right, although the 50 is about 30% smaller than the Alpair 6P/M, and the 150 is nearly 250% larger than the Alpair 10.2, so we're not really comparing like with like. Nice drivers though, the Bandors. Agreed, & less than nothing wrong with running wideband with support. My current favourite unit for midtweet duties is the FF85wk (same as Dave), which is roughly the same size as the Bandor 50. Not much to choose between any of the 50mm Bandors & the Fostex in terms of measured response (i.e. they're all extremely good); the latter is a bit cheaper & easier to get hold of for a lot of people though.
haha this is great! Just when i think i know what im talking about... Of course the A6 isnt a 2incher...doh. The MA names confuse me, but its a poor excuse. As for 2 inchers, both the TB W2-800SL (20 quid) and the Visaton FRS5X (6 quid) are both pretty damned good. What i paid counts in this case, the TBs are cleaner. The Omnes look ok, arent those 3inch-ish like the A6, and like the W3s i have.
Oh and i think i meant the A12 basswide. No matter, the moment passed long ago.
Oh and i think i meant the A12 basswide. No matter, the moment passed long ago.
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Bill,
The Omnes drivers look interesting - what application are you using them in? How is the dispersion?
One forum member strongly recommedns the Tangband 3" for dispersion and depth of 3D soundtsage:
Tang Band W3-1797S 3" Neodymium Midrange Driver 264-888
Any experience with this one?
Mondo - A12BW - don't recall such a driver in existence...
The Omnes drivers look interesting - what application are you using them in? How is the dispersion?
One forum member strongly recommedns the Tangband 3" for dispersion and depth of 3D soundtsage:
Tang Band W3-1797S 3" Neodymium Midrange Driver 264-888
Any experience with this one?
Mondo - A12BW - don't recall such a driver in existence...
Zman, i dont recall the model, but it was the basswide. Initially thought it was an A10, then thought it was an A12. Now im confused beyond belief.
As for the 3 inch Tangbands, my experience is good. I dont have the driver you mention, but I have the W3_1285SG and these sound really good, no notches required and very flat.
As for the 3 inch Tangbands, my experience is good. I dont have the driver you mention, but I have the W3_1285SG and these sound really good, no notches required and very flat.
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The original Bandor 50 shared some features with the original Jordan 50mm module. Both have been developed since they first appeared in the late 1970s.
AFAIK, the larger Bandor units have only ever been intended as bass units to support the 50mm unit - the Pentachord design used one, for instance - potentially getting a higher performance than a larger, wideband driver on its own.
Jordan and Bandor have been championing the benefits a low-crossover, wideband driver since the late 70s.
30 years on, we're seeing BMR-based speakers appear which push the same philosophy, such as the Naim, Etude and the Martin Colloms Rhythm King DIY design.
What goes around, etc …
AFAIK, the larger Bandor units have only ever been intended as bass units to support the 50mm unit - the Pentachord design used one, for instance - potentially getting a higher performance than a larger, wideband driver on its own.
Jordan and Bandor have been championing the benefits a low-crossover, wideband driver since the late 70s.
30 years on, we're seeing BMR-based speakers appear which push the same philosophy, such as the Naim, Etude and the Martin Colloms Rhythm King DIY design.
What goes around, etc …
I stuck one in a simple box and it sounded v good, can't comment on stereo imaging just yet..the chassis diameter is also v compact and it seems to go quite loud too. I'll use them in a 'omni' transmission line, a plastic pipe with a central section to double the length.
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