taming harshness of fostex FF125WK

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frugal-phile™
Joined 2001
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redo the Fe series and start from ground zero. They need to put the banana fiber cone on the shelf for now.

None of the current gen FE have banana pulp cones.

I had one guy tell me why would you spend $50.00 on a fostex when you can get this brand over here with better frames and magnets and phase plugs and so on?

None of the $50 Fostex are big enuff for a whizzer cone (something that if possible should be avoided). And usually if there is no whizzer a phase plug not needed. Nothing wrong with the Fostex magnets or frames.

They definitely benefit from a work over.

This person will not even use a fostex

I can relate. I personally prefer the smaller drivers. And i don't ever live with them stock. The FF85wKeN is one of my favorite 3 drivers.

Well dave you could e-mail me and I could tell you some thoughts I have

Feel free. My email is on any of my sites. I can mail you back some of the comments from some of my clients.

P.s. I forgot the F-120a driver the 5" inch fullrange $252.14 each?

It is a 4 1/2" driver.

This driver is one of their higher-end drivers. It sports a whole lot of expensive Alnico. I feel it is up on the part of the vlue curve where you start paying a lot for small increments of improvement. The broadly similar FX120 is a much better value. Jeff can add comments about them. Before & after.

dave
 
$50 seems reasonable for around a 4" driver nowadays (4.5").

$120 for the fx120 seems a stretch for a single 5" but people do like it.

$252 for the alnico fx120?
That seems a bit steep.

The fx120 seems to be a better driver than the ff125wk, but at more than double the cost (ouch).

Norman
 
I'm still not hearing the "issues" with 125s that some folks gripe about (rather like the previous 127FE) , and along with MA Alpair 7.3 they'd certainly be on my short list for simple single driver FR system

I am with Chris here, I heard them in their official "BK" cabinet in Japan and I liked the sound, it was not harsh to my ears. I even bought a pair then. I may buy the BK cabinets next time I am in Japan. The packaging and weight could still fit in my business class limit. I also liked the 105 which was very similar except for a slightly lighter bass, as expected. The 85 was obviously refined, but personally I would not use it without a sub, or in a FAST configuration - I want some bass in my music. I also liked the 165 and 225, but they will benefit from a tweeter.

Fostex drivers are expensive?

I partly agree with JDM. My big beef is the cheap stamped baskets. Tang Band units at the same price often "feel" a lot more expensive and luxurious.
It must be said however that the FFxx5WK series produces rather nice tones, in spite of their stamped baskets. The Fexx6En series has never been my favourite however.

It is a pity that they don't replace their sigma series with their limited editions. I heard 2 limited edition fostexes over time and they were remarkable, much better than the sigma series.
 
I am with Chris here, I heard them in their official "BK" cabinet in Japan and I liked the sound, it was not harsh to my ears. I even bought a pair then. I may buy the BK cabinets next time I am in Japan. The packaging and weight could still fit in my business class limit. I also liked the 105 which was very similar except for a slightly lighter bass, as expected. The 85 was obviously refined, but personally I would not use it without a sub, or in a FAST configuration - I want some bass in my music. I also liked the 165 and 225, but they will benefit from a tweeter.



I partly agree with JDM. My big beef is the cheap stamped baskets. Tang Band units at the same price often "feel" a lot more expensive and luxurious.
It must be said however that the FFxx5WK series produces rather nice tones, in spite of their stamped baskets. The Fexx6En series has never been my favourite however.

It is a pity that they don't replace their sigma series with their limited editions. I heard 2 limited edition fostexes over time and they were remarkable, much better than the sigma series.


FWIW, the big gripe I'd have with the "limited editions", is the "limited" part, and the cost - who are they kidding, except for alnico magnetics, there's very material or labor wise to justify the cost of many of those, and they certainly don't always perform substantially better than standard models.

A few years back a buddy of mine had a pair of the FE206ESR in the fridge sized Fostex BLH design - except for a lack of top end that was easily enough remedied with the addition of bullet supertweeters (costing more than the FR btw), and some midrange colorations most notable on vocals that I'm convinced were due to the enclosure, they were quite impressive.

OTOH, one of the most fatiguing and unlistenable drivers I've heard in a long time was a special edition - FE138ESR. They made a decent enough (if not thrifty) mid-bass driver, but very hard to listen to full range.
 
Disabled Account
Joined 2009
Well I wanted to say I did see the metronome awhile ago. I didn't build this diy box to copy or look like anyones else's speakers. I wanted to build something different and why not do a trapizod box as they call it.

I clearly remember other trapezoid designs so it is not unique at all. And if you had a proper understanding modelling and the interactions with a room then you would discover that putting the port in the bottom as with the metronome has some some very large benefits.
 
frugal-phile™
Joined 2001
Paid Member
OTOH, one of the most fatiguing and unlistenable drivers I've heard in a long time was a special edition - FE138ESR. They made a decent enough (if not thrifty) mid-bass driver, but very hard to listen to full range.

People talk about Fostex having shout... these literally shrieked. I wouldn't go as far as saying they'd be good midbasses. They did really good bass thou (used in a FAST with FF85)

dave
 
The Odoug Bro

Not to sound like a broken record...but there was a lot of R&D in to this.

As far as the 120's, have a few of them, nice bass. The 125s are about 1/2 the :2c: and in this box, the bass is about the same.

The 125 have very nice midrange (and now bass). I don't know why more energy hasn't been spent on a simple filter.

I'm about ready to go ask that popular fellow on the multi-range page, he seems to well versed in XO design.
 

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Price is also dependent on how many they make, where they make them, what their overhead for R&D is and so on. Very few companies don't have a middleman. Having worked in manufacturing, if you understood the entire chain, it would take your breath away. Look at my least favorite driver, the 125. I bet it left the factory at under $7 US. $57 at my door is not a lot of markup.

Go to the drug store and look at the cheapest calculator on the shelf. About $5. Now think in your mind all the parts, all the steps and all the middlemen it took to put that on the shelf. Darn near impossible.

My beef if they did not quite finish the engineering. They seemed to have used the same paper for all sizes, and that just won't work.
 
None of the current gen FE have banana pulp cones. Well it said it in the driver specs and info so please explain? Now the FF series doesn't have the yellow cones really need to do something about that color.

Hello dave I meant this type of cone. Took it from the fe126en drivers copyed it.


Fostex FE126En 4" Full Range
ES Banana Pulp Cone. Banana fiber pulp provides a fine, supple and dense cone material which improves mid-high frequency response.
Treated cloth surround. (new version, thus the new "n" in the name)
The low Qts makes this driver useful in back loaked horn enclosure.

I really don't think their is anything new with the new versions but, again who am I?

None of the $50 Fostex are big enuff for a whizzer cone (something that if possible should be avoided). And usually if there is no whizzer a phase plug not needed. Nothing wrong with the Fostex magnets or frames.

They definitely benefit from a work over.

I can relate. I personally prefer the smaller drivers. And i don't ever live with them stock. The FF85wKeN is one of my favorite 3 drivers.

Feel free. My email is on any of my sites. I can mail you back some of the comments from some of my clients.

It is a 4 1/2" driver.

This driver is one of their higher-end drivers. It sports a whole lot of expensive Alnico. I feel it is up on the part of the vlue curve where you start paying a lot for small increments of improvement. The broadly similar FX120 is a much better value. Jeff can add comments about them. Before & after. Thanks for the info it helps.

dave
 
the problem with the 127's was that they sounded nice. It was only after quite some time of listening that a bit of fatigue settled in. And then I suspected the amp. After awhile you start to realize that each time you sit down to listen to the stock drivers, that listening fatigue is inevitable and sooner or later you find it's the first thing on your mind when you fire them up. Then you can't ignore it - you hear it as soon as the darn things are powered up. So listening to these drivers in the store doesn't tell you if you can live with them or not. There may be people for whom these drivers do not fatigue but it seems there's only one way to find out if it affects you or not. Since there are other drivers to choose from out there, why bother with the 125 when the FR plot looks rather like the 127. Not worth the time and effort to me. YMMV.
 
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I clearly remember other trapezoid designs so it is not unique at all. And if you had a proper understanding modelling and the interactions with a room then you would discover that putting the port in the bottom as with the metronome has some some very large benefits.


Yes that is what I am saying the design is not new and not mine own design adn I will not take credit for the shape of the boxes. Now whats in the box and how its braced and how the air is directed out is new and my own design. Now putting the port at the bottom hummmm? I would have to think how well it would work on a carpeted floor,tile floor,wood floor, and a cement floors? I put the port in the back for me to be able to give more bass out of this design and out of the room by pushing it towards the wall or pulling it out to have less bass. I also did it due to little kids hands and kids dropping or putting things in places they should not be. I have dealt with this alot of times. Also I love the way your speaker looks but, again I am doing my own thing. If you lived near by I would enjoy sitting and talking and compairing notes and see what you thoughts were on this speaker I built? Thanks for you help. Jdm
 
the problem with the 127's was that they sounded nice. It was only after quite some time of listening that a bit of fatigue settled in. And then I suspected the amp. After awhile you start to realize that each time you sit down to listen to the stock drivers, that listening fatigue is inevitable and sooner or later you find it's the first thing on your mind when you fire them up. Then you can't ignore it - you hear it as soon as the darn things are powered up. So listening to these drivers in the store doesn't tell you if you can live with them or not. There may be people for whom these drivers do not fatigue but it seems there's only one way to find out if it affects you or not. Since there are other drivers to choose from out there, why bother with the 125 when the FR plot looks rather like the 127. Not worth the time and effort to me. YMMV.


I agree with you but, on the other hand I have had multi ways for years and I have had big buck speakers. So from going from a multi way to a single driver is really night and day. I found this out with the fe206e driver 10 years ago. It had a bite and very over bright in a certain freq. range but, on the other hand they sound like a dream for alot of music.They were fast and very natural sounding and sounded like the person was in the room. So Again I can live with the peakness or brightness of the fostex drivers. Next up will be the Fx120 drivers. Also have you tryed the Fe108ez drivers a real step up from the Fe series I have done side by side. They are a really good deal. I got them for very cheap or I would not have bought them and sold them due to lack of funds for other projects .Jdm
 
I believe Madisound (I presume that's where you got the quote from) are incorrect. The old E series units used a banana pulp based paper cone. As I understand it, though I could be incorrect in this, the cone in the En units is based on an Abaca pulp, which is related to, but not the same as, the banana plant. The data sheets also note a new diaphragm material.
 
frugal-phile™
Joined 2001
Paid Member
Fostex FE126En 4" Full Range
ES Banana Pulp Cone. Banana fiber pulp provides a fine, supple and dense cone material which improves mid-high frequency response.
Treated cloth surround. (new version, thus the new "n" in the name)
The low Qts makes this driver useful in back loaked horn enclosure.

I really don't think their is anything new with the new versions but, again who am I?

This is the cut & paste from the data sheet i have:

ES cone and center cap are adapted. This new diaphragm material has the fine, supple and high density fiber, and its characteristics successfully improve the mid-high frequency reproduction.

No mention of banana pulp. The new En are definitely different. THis was rammed home when i went to make a set of robin's egg blue FE126En. The lovely pale blue went on and the cone turned BRIGHT green.

dave
 
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