picked up some 8" neo magnet GUI-Sound/AN units?
they're un-badged as you can see in the picture. How likely is it that these are going to be the same as the AN8 neo's listed on common sense audio?
kinda don't want to deal with Dicks as i'm sure he'll sell me another sales pitch that these are terrible and not his units and i should buy his.
face value they sound pretty good and look to be very well put together.
http://www.gui-sound.com/upload/2008101114150143.pdf
they look to be a neo version of ^those^
the other question is, what is the minimum measurement i'd need to get an idea of which unit these are meant to be? i've read a lot about adding weights, using boxes with bags etc and am wondering if there's an easier way and one that doesn't involve me sticking things to the delicate looking cones.
they're un-badged as you can see in the picture. How likely is it that these are going to be the same as the AN8 neo's listed on common sense audio?
kinda don't want to deal with Dicks as i'm sure he'll sell me another sales pitch that these are terrible and not his units and i should buy his.
face value they sound pretty good and look to be very well put together.
http://www.gui-sound.com/upload/2008101114150143.pdf
they look to be a neo version of ^those^
the other question is, what is the minimum measurement i'd need to get an idea of which unit these are meant to be? i've read a lot about adding weights, using boxes with bags etc and am wondering if there's an easier way and one that doesn't involve me sticking things to the delicate looking cones.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Nice drivers, congratulations for the purchase. When the you had a sound impression, please inform us your opinion.
I also dislike add mass to the cone, the moving mass in FRs had to be small, the the lightest possible.
I feel add mass to the cone is OK just for woofers.
I assume you will use a BR box, If you put a certain amount of woolen blanket on the rear wall, the bass will increase significantly.
Godd luck
I also dislike add mass to the cone, the moving mass in FRs had to be small, the the lightest possible.
I feel add mass to the cone is OK just for woofers.
I assume you will use a BR box, If you put a certain amount of woolen blanket on the rear wall, the bass will increase significantly.
Godd luck
i'm trying to make a horn for them, unfortunately horns have completely and entirely outwitted me (not that i've had much success elsewhere that is!).
the BiB or metronome type T-Line is the fall back option.
Go for bibs...
For measurement, buy http://www.amazon.com/Testing-Loudspeakers-Joseph-DAppolito/dp/1882580176
The best 40 dollars you'll spend on diy speaker building.
For measurement, buy http://www.amazon.com/Testing-Loudspeakers-Joseph-DAppolito/dp/1882580176
The best 40 dollars you'll spend on diy speaker building.
It's really not hard to acquire T/S parameters yourself:
Measuring Loudspeaker Driver Parameters
Adding weight to the cone or sticking the driver in a small box is the trickiest part and is the way to give you the Vas parameter. You can get an idea of what type of enclosure the driver will be good in with Fs/Qts only, while Vas will let you know if this box will be big or small. Still better to measure it all.
IG
Measuring Loudspeaker Driver Parameters
Adding weight to the cone or sticking the driver in a small box is the trickiest part and is the way to give you the Vas parameter. You can get an idea of what type of enclosure the driver will be good in with Fs/Qts only, while Vas will let you know if this box will be big or small. Still better to measure it all.
IG
i've managed to get some working T/S specs for these now using LIMP.
AN8 neo - specs
FS - 41.4hz
VAS - 86.2
QTS - 0.164
QES - 0.173
QMS - 3.412
BL - 10.7
guide sound factory spec for similar looking ferrite version
FS - 42.6hz
VAS - 84.7
QTS - 0.215
QES - 0.226
QMS - 4.417
BL - 9.3
averages specs (see complete specs in picture) for my clones.
FS - 56.4hz
VAS - 41.6
QTS - 0.22
QES - 0.24
QMS - 2.96
BL - 11.86
test protocols were as follows.
10.3 ohm resistor
6.6 g added mass
driver suspended approx 3 feet from any reflecting surface, orientated so it was no parallel with any flat surfaces
average of 5mins of pink noise were used
questions.
1) do these look about right?
there's a huge discrepancy between FS and VAS on all my measurements VS all the AN drivers and those listed on GUI sound.
2) is there anything i can do to make test more accurate?
more/less added mass? higher test resistor?
3) do these specs make the driver look more appealing for back loaded horn use
the mass roll off is 470(?). (2x56.4)/0.24. or am i still better off sticking with current plan of BiB style enclosure?
if so are there any pre made designs that it would just slot into?
thanks for your help
AN8 neo - specs
FS - 41.4hz
VAS - 86.2
QTS - 0.164
QES - 0.173
QMS - 3.412
BL - 10.7
guide sound factory spec for similar looking ferrite version
FS - 42.6hz
VAS - 84.7
QTS - 0.215
QES - 0.226
QMS - 4.417
BL - 9.3
averages specs (see complete specs in picture) for my clones.
FS - 56.4hz
VAS - 41.6
QTS - 0.22
QES - 0.24
QMS - 2.96
BL - 11.86
test protocols were as follows.
10.3 ohm resistor
6.6 g added mass
driver suspended approx 3 feet from any reflecting surface, orientated so it was no parallel with any flat surfaces
average of 5mins of pink noise were used
questions.
1) do these look about right?
there's a huge discrepancy between FS and VAS on all my measurements VS all the AN drivers and those listed on GUI sound.
2) is there anything i can do to make test more accurate?
more/less added mass? higher test resistor?
3) do these specs make the driver look more appealing for back loaded horn use
the mass roll off is 470(?). (2x56.4)/0.24. or am i still better off sticking with current plan of BiB style enclosure?
if so are there any pre made designs that it would just slot into?
thanks for your help
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
the other concern actually.
below picture is the set up, is the lack of 'real' connection between components going to cause a problem if it is all calibrated? wasn't going to bother soldering the entire thing if i could just use crocodile clips.
below picture is the set up, is the lack of 'real' connection between components going to cause a problem if it is all calibrated? wasn't going to bother soldering the entire thing if i could just use crocodile clips.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
It's hard for me to understand why David Dicks is the favorite whipping boy for so many people at diyaudio. In my dealings with him I have found him to be fair and open to anyone trying their own ideas of what works best with the products he sells. Everyone comes up with their own favorite drivers for any application from any source and I never hear the same trashing going out about Madisound or Parts Express or any other manufacturer or vendor. After all some people have had good results with the AN drivers even if a network or enabling or whatever was required to get the best out of them. How is that so different from other drivers?
It's probably because of his cavalier approach to the physics of audio. His contention that any driver can go into any box is slightly beyond reality. With a background like this, it is hard to take him seriously.
Bob
for me personally, his sales pitch is a little too pushy and euphoric. all the reviews and hype surrounding the product just smells suspect. i only picked these up because they were considerably cheaper than getting them direct. the same price as some fostex 206en's. i thought why not, these won't require me cutting them up and putting in a phase plug.
tbh, i'm pretty happy with the sound tho and from a quick frequency blast they don't seem too bad. i will be changing the phase plug shape tho, not a big fan of the sound the bullet shape produces.
tbh, i'm pretty happy with the sound tho and from a quick frequency blast they don't seem too bad. i will be changing the phase plug shape tho, not a big fan of the sound the bullet shape produces.
did these again as i noticed the membrane radius were not the same. also used a 20ohm resistor this time. doesn't really change the measurements much. ambient temp is different too, but doesn't seem to change anything significantly.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
To add on to Bob's message: This is painfully obvious when modeling David's boxes with the as found driver measurements results in some really unacceptable FR curves. In some cases these are simply fixed by adding length to the port (David has previously been adament that port tubes are not to be used.)
Speaking for myself, humour aside, like Bob, I have nothing personally against David Dicks, or his Audio Nirvana range. The units I've heard have been OK for what they are. I will however, call 'em as I see 'em, vis-a-vis boxes etc.
Shore answer re the questions
1/ Purely on the basis of a quick gander, yes
2/ Looks like you've already tried altering things, so probably not, they're likely to be ~'good enough' (there is a well-known phrase in design offices and engineering in general: 'the best is the enemy of the good enough')
3/ The BIB is a back-horn. Still somewhat higher than ideal but probably close enough if you're running a high output impedance amplifier. Don't forget to design with the output impedance in mind.
Shore answer re the questions
1/ Purely on the basis of a quick gander, yes
2/ Looks like you've already tried altering things, so probably not, they're likely to be ~'good enough' (there is a well-known phrase in design offices and engineering in general: 'the best is the enemy of the good enough')
3/ The BIB is a back-horn. Still somewhat higher than ideal but probably close enough if you're running a high output impedance amplifier. Don't forget to design with the output impedance in mind.
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