Home Theater Design Advice

[planet10]

I have a lazy susan of small FRs (sometimes larger) rotating thru my 2.0 HT. The biamped helper woofers are fairly constant). Idonothave any complaints with levels (i have a dedicated HT decorder which uses my regular hifi amp (20w). My room is (fairly) big. At least with my treated drivers in these boxes i have no issues with sweet spot -- one of my chairs is outside of the left speaker i still get imaging and decent HF.

Mar-Kel70wT in my system at the moment -- Chris, these are the ones for the woof-wT we were recently talking about.



dave

[kctess5]

I got that link working, I think it was just my phone. I like those designs quite a lot. I think I may go with one of those. Maybe 2 way ZA5.2 ported for the LR and surrounds, and the ZA5.3c MTM for my center.

I probably could get a FR driver to work but I would guess that the receiver puts out ~100w and between my younger sister and parents the likelihood of some 20w drivers being instantly blown is a bit high for my taste.

I could probably stretch my budget (that is of course the 3rd person "my") to accommodate those plans. The drivers combined for the system I described would cost about $360 and I need to figure out how much the drivers would be.

I can save on pretty much everything else, bare unfinished mdf boxes because they wont be visible, pcv scrap ports, etc.

I'll figure out my crossovers (something new for me ) and report back in a few hours.

Thanks everyone!

BTW those speakers are gorgeous Dave

[sreten]

Originally Posted by chrisb

Meeting your target budget with multiways of this quality will be rather a challenge.

Hi,

Yes. $250 for drivers for five speakers is asking a lot, as is assuming
with FR drivers somehow filters can be easily ignored, they can't.

Well they can be, but that is a philosophy, not a design decision.

Zaph|Audio

Details a family of designs where you can adjust the filters for
driver placement for best total balance. Its relatively cheap
for one good reason, you must use a sub and preferably two,
even though it might be one mono 4 ohm amplifier driving
two 8 ohm subwoofer cabinets.
You must have a good, flexible in set up, AV amplifier.

FR fans seem to enjoy bashing Zaphs designs without ever
suggesting anything remotely comparable for the budget.

With 3" drivers, about the largest you get get without
serious treble issues for FR, the bulk of the budget
transfers to the subs, dual subs being preferable.

rgds, sreten.

[ODougbo]

I'd look at the Fostex FF125wks, that's a heck of 5" speaker and in your price range.

I'm really enjoy my pair and will be building more soon.

[planet10]

Originally Posted by kctess5

I probably could get a FR driver to work but I would guess that the receiver puts out ~100w and between my younger sister and parents the likelihood of some 20w drivers being instantly blown is a bit high for my taste.

Power ratings are one of the least standardized (ie none) and most useless specifications for home hifi drivers in exixtance. I always ignore it.

dave

[Bigun]

I designed and built a complete 5.1 system for my own home a couple of years ago, inspired by this forum. I used single full range drivers, each one 4.5" and installed in an Onken (bass reflex) style enclosure. The idea was to cross-over to a sub at 80Hz. I made a powerful sub woofer to go with.

I did not find the full range drivers to be adequate. I like the sound of full range for music, but for HT it simply did not have the balls for the job. Whilst I thought the unique qualities of small full range speakers would be a step up on the usual approach, it was in the end not as satisfying. Movies are not music.

I now use fairly large commercial multi-way speakers (except for the centre which I also plan to upgrade to a good sized 2-way) and I'm very pleased with the results. These speakers have 6" bass drivers, they dig deep (lower than 80Hz) and they deliver real power into the room.

As this is DIY you might not want to hear the following suggestion - I would advise you to buy commercial speakers. You can get some really good deals on speakers that are more than adequate for HT whereas making your own with high quality full range drivers is not as cheap as it first appears. It will save you a lot of time and effort building your own - I was frustrated in the end with waiting to get the system up and running which was pressure I didn't want from a hobby. You will be able to audition them before you buy them too. It was a lot of work making 5 speakers from scratch, the wood work, the electrical work etc. Once your dad is enjoying his movies, you can always have a bash at making your own and if they are that much better, swap them out and flog off the old ones.

You also won't want to hear this - I had my rear speakers mounted on the ceiling. Big failure. The sound is simply coming from the wrong place. Even though they were angled down it did not generate a 'surround sound' and never worked well. I tried some speakers at the proper height by using a pair of floorstanders for the rear surrounds - magnificent. The cables are a nuisance, but I kind of got over that once I heard my first blu-ray with powerful surround sound. And cables are easier to hide these days than in the past - such as flatwire hidden under the carpet, rug or under the skirting board (or is it called base board or kick board in America ?).

[ODougbo]

The budget is limited here and looks is not that important; store bought speakers would not be a good choice.

Before I found out about full range I was using these, also build them for friends, etc. They are very, very natural sounding and using one as a center channel now. They are reasonably priced, considering the drivers and the well built crossover.

HDS Home Theater Kit - Parts Only: Madisound Speaker Store

[kctess5]

As this is DIY you might not want to hear the following suggestion

The budget is limited here and looks is not that important; store bought speakers would not be a good choice.

Looks like your both right

Before I found out about full range I was using these, also build them for friends, etc. They are very, very natural sounding and using one as a center channel now. They are reasonably priced, considering the drivers and the well built crossover.

HDS Home Theater Kit - Parts Only: Madisound Speaker Store

Those look great! Maybe if I ordered the parts separately and assembled them myself I could keep the price down, approx $600 for 5 of those is a bit much for my liking, even if I could save $100 that would be a good option.

You also won't want to hear this - I had my rear speakers mounted on the ceiling. Big failure. The sound is simply coming from the wrong place. Even though they were angled down it did not generate a 'surround sound' and never worked well. I tried some speakers at the proper height by using a pair of floorstanders for the rear surrounds - magnificent. The cables are a nuisance, but I kind of got over that once I heard my first blu-ray with powerful surround sound. And cables are easier to hide these days than in the past - such as flatwire hidden under the carpet, rug or under the skirting board (or is it called base board or kick board in America ?).

I actually agree with you on this one but my moms not going to change her mind and we already have all the wiring up there, I would just replace whats currently there. I lobbied for towers mounted on the walls but she wasn't into it. Also she doesn't really like surround sound because she has trouble focusing on the dialogue when the surrounds are noticeable or something so they will be at low volumes and much less important that the LCRs

I was frustrated in the end with waiting to get the system up and running

Thats not a problem, we already have a system in place but its pretty much mass market low-fi and I'm just replacing it so downtime will only be a few hours during the replacement

It seems to me that my best option is to either use one of those kits or model my own system closely after one of them just because the massive amount of design needed for 5 speakers all at once

[ODougbo]

Jumping into HT is expensive when you need 5 (or more) speakers. The Madisound kit is priced well, and that's a custom crossover they designed/tested, no way to DIY that. Besides if you add up the parts, the $132 is a good deal anyway, however still $660, without shipping.

The Fostex 125wks mentioned is arguably the best bank for the buck. If you can build P10's Fonken boxes, that would be best. I did a few quickie builds for the 125wk. The pic on the right is the plans from Fostex , that box is not very exciting...bla.

[sreten]

Hi,

5 identical speakers are generally not a good idea for HT.

A cheaper option would be Zaphs ZMV5's L,R & C, with the low BSC
option used for the centre, and the low BSC ZMB4's for the rears.

Zaph|Audio - ZMV5 - MCM / Vifa 5" System
Zaph|Audio - 4" Bargain Mini

If the rears are going to turned down a lot, possibly just use whatever
is currently used as left and right for the rears, cut down on the work.

rgds, sreten.