Recommendations (Please)

[cogitech]

Hello again everyone,

(I appreciate your pateince as you read the following novel and I apologize in advance)

You may recall that I was once toying with the idea of building a pair of small, full range speakers for rear surrounds, then ended up getting a pair of Mirage OmniSats basically for free and then abandoned the DIY idea.

Well, now I am back, and this time I have much bigger plans. I have moved to a new house and I now have two audio systems; a HT setup and a 2-channel (music only) setup.

I have come to this forum specifically because I think full range towers will offer me a simple build (I am a newbie, after all) and fantastic sound (from what I have been reading). But, perhaps after I explain my situation you might lead me in an entirely different direction. I am going to remain very open-minded about this and really take my time.

My current 2-channel (living room) system is: Asus EeePC (Linux) --> ALSA (direct)--> HotAudio DAC Wow --> Yamaha R-S300 (Pure Direct mode) --> PSB Image B15 on 30" stands.

The PSBs are borrowed from my HT basement setup. I use Pure Direct on the Yamaha and do some minor EQing in software (Audacious).

I have to say that, with the exception of a lack in the very low end (the PSBs drift off at about 50hz), I am very impressed overall by what I am hearing from this setup (for what it cost me). The sound stage is very open, and overall it seems very accurate. Not warm or cold, and not fatiguing unless it is very, very loud.

I've also just received shipment of a Grant Fidelity B-283 tube buffer (AKA Yaqin CD2) which I plan to insert between the DAC Wow and the Yamaha. That may stay or go, depending on how it sounds.

As much as I like the PSBs, I really would prefer something that goes down to at least the 38hz range confidently. I could add a sub-woofer, but I'm not keen to do so. The PSBs will go back down to the HT setup and I will either buy or build a new pair of proper speakers.

Which brings me to my question: In a 15'x20', carpeted room with flat ceilings and plenty of furniture and the above audio gear, what (full range) DIY speakers would you add? Keep in mind that I am a newbie and I would like to keep the build simple and relatively affordable. I have been looking at some of the "Pensil" designs, etc. over at Creative Sound Solutions (creativesound.ca) and I am pretty confident that I could build some of those cabinets (I am quite good with my hands).

Also, what are the chances that I will end up with speakers that look great and sound not-so-great? Are these designs "tried and true" to the point where as long as I take my time I will end up with "audiophile" quality speakers at a bargain price? How would some of these speaker designs compare to mid-range PSBs such as the ones I own?

Sorry for all the questions and thanks in advance to anyone who cares to comment.

[cogitech]

OK... Hmmmm... Ignore the above novel and simply state which is your favourite DIY full range (single driver) tower speaker design which does not require a sub (ie. hits in the mid to high 30hz range on its own) and can sit within 6-8 inches of the back wall.

(Please )

[Godzilla]

If you are putting them into corners i'd recommend a pair of BIBs with a Fostex 6" 167 or 168 or a Fostex 8" with a 206 or 225... whatever are currently available... add tweeter to taste if you like.

[cogitech]

Thanks. What are BIBs?

BTW, one will be about 4 feet from the corner, the other will not be near a corner. They'll be about 8 feet apart and the listening position will be about 12 feet away.

[chrisb]

Originally Posted by cogitech

Thanks. What are BIBs?

BTW, one will be about 4 feet from the corner, the other will not be near a corner. They'll be about 8 feet apart and the listening position will be about 12 feet away.

BIB = Bigger Is Better a nickname I think coined by the late Terry Cain:

Single Driver Website

essentially a chamberless back-loaded horn, intended to use 3-boundary/corner loading

close to as simple a build as you can get, but for larger drivers such as 6-8" capable of digging that low, can get, well, Big

[GM]

Originally Posted by cogitech

.......simply state which is your favourite DIY full range (single driver) tower speaker design which does not require a sub (ie. hits in the mid to high 30hz range on its own) and can sit within 6-8 inches of the back wall.

Simply stated, without corner loading, it doesn't exist in a tower alignment, at least not at low distortion except at SPLs too low to justify such a low tuning. That said, the American distributor for Jordan has some low tuned JX92S MLTLs that might meet your approval since this driver has about the most usable Xmax I've encountered without too much fear of bottoming it out without some audible warning.

GM

[TerryO]

Good advice so far, but I have a couple of questions.

First , why are you not so "keen" to use a subwoofer? I've heard many people say that, but I've never seen a good answer, other than they absolutely lacked space, or their wife would kill them.

Second, you seem to have some doubts about the designs you've looked at so far. I've heard quite a few of the CSS and Planet10 designs (some designed by GM, IIRC) and they're quite good. I'd even opine that most are better than what you have now, although PSBs are fairly good commercial speakers.

The BIB designs need boundary reinforcement, a back wall or a corner, but they're easy to build and if you use decent drivers, you could always build another design using those drivers, if you found your first pair lacked whatever you desire.

Best Regards,
TerryO

[chrisb]

While my personal favorite Alpair driver is the 7 (now 7.3), I'd suggest the 10.2 or even 12.2 in Pensil for consideration. Enclosures are not the tiniest of footprints, but certainly capable of digging deep.

and second to Terry's query for reluctance on separate (sub) woofers - quite often room dimensions and acoustics will benefit from (multiple) enclosures for the lowest frequency at locations other than that for the "mains"

[buzzforb]

10.2 is very good in the Pensil. I hope to build some of Dave's miniOnkens for them after building a pair for my new 7.3's. I think the 10.2 is probably a better all around driver for most. I get the sense that the 7.3's are for audio use only as they are very revealing of what is put through them.

[Nanook]

...the Monoliths..as per P10 (et al). You have the room. I have a set of the Demetris (the large monoliths at 38-1/2" H x 17-1/2"W x 9-1/4"D) made for 8" drivers. I personally think the bass is more than respectable (this does depend on the drivers of choice), and all the other "hi-fi" comments regarding PRAT. Hmmmm..., maybe a Demetri with super-tweeter. Still a little latge for my 11-1/2' X 19' "room" (open ended on a narrow side with an additional 10' to 12' behind a pony wall, so effectively a 11-1/2' X 31' room).

These would be interesting with some "eN" drivers. Or perhaps a set of the Demetris' little sister, the Milevas with P10-XXeN drivers (XX= Dave or Chris' recommeends based on their best guess, or modelling). Maybe even the old Pioneer stand bys: the infamous B20FU-51FW. I really neeed to build a pair and start tweaking to see how far these guys can be taken. See a nice review of these at the diy section on http://www.enjoythemusic.com.

Dave and/or Chris, did you guys ever build any of the Demetris? If not, and assuming I can actually plan and make it out to the Island next year, perhaps something to bring along?