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Old 3rd April 2011, 03:03 AM   #11
Salas is offline Salas  Greece
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Brines View Post
brickwalls at 5k and doesn't recover to the unmodded traces until 9k.

Bob
Killing the presence range and most of treble...
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Old 3rd April 2011, 03:27 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
Bob,

Need to know more details about your application. It is well known that too heavy a hand can screw up the HF.

dave
I put two coats of Mod Podge, diluted 1:1 with water. Cone and whzzer got the same treatment. Note that problems don't occur until 5K. Also note that the notch is much deeper with the phase plugs. I did a test with the phase plug removed, i.e. without the dustcap. The trace was very similar to the one with the phase plug in place. I know from previous experience that the real effect of a phase plug is to put a notch in the frequency response that corresponds to the sibilance spike of female speakers who swallow the mic. Makes the singers sound smoother. I'm going to check my other speakers with phase plugs. The effect may be primarily due to removing the dust cap.

Bob

Last edited by Bob Brines; 3rd April 2011 at 03:30 AM.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 03:43 AM   #13
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>>> Makes the singers sound smoother. I'm going to check my other speakers with phase plugs. The effect may be primarily due to removing the dust cap.

I just modded a Beta 12lta with great results! Removing the dustcap improved the driver and adding the phase plug smoothed the sound nicely... most notably with female vocals. Sorry about your drivers Bob... that stinks! Thanks for posting your charts.

Zilla
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Old 3rd April 2011, 03:57 AM   #14
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1:1 is a higher dilution than i use, much higher... Just a couple weeks ago i destroyed a pair of FE167e experimenting with that wet a solution -- it warped the cones

dave
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Old 3rd April 2011, 04:03 AM   #15
Salas is offline Salas  Greece
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Originally Posted by Bob Brines View Post
I know from previous experience that the real effect of a phase plug is to put a notch in the frequency response that corresponds to the sibilance spike of female speakers who swallow the mic. Makes the singers sound smoother. Bob
Sibilance is centred around 7K.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 05:45 AM   #16
Bigun is offline Bigun  Canada
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7k being the cone break up mode for the now defunct 127e. I tried the damar / trifoil treatment on a pair of those cones but it didn't really fix the problem. It made a slight improvement but I think I 'lost' a little magic in proportion. Based on my experience with the 127e I'm not so convinced that Fostex always knows what they are doing with their designs. However, I would balance my experience against that of many happy customers of the 127e.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 10:16 AM   #17
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To Bob Brines,

Working on the new fostex as well.
Adjusted my previous blh design for the FE166En.
Did a group build with four people.
Compared the "old"166 to the "new.
New : after break-in 200+ hours the still had some "metal" sound in them.
So we started some reversible tweaks.
long story short:

everybody likes the "open cell tweak" ,open cell recht.JPG

open cell schuin.JPG in combination with the FT17H.
See pics.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 10:17 AM   #18
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Forgot one.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 10:50 AM   #19
borispm is offline borispm  Hong Kong
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Hi Bob,
As you've already "ruined" your driver, I guess it's worthwhile to remove the whizzer as well and see if the high frequency resonance is still there. Just my two cents though.
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Old 3rd April 2011, 12:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigaudioscotto View Post
Hi Bob
I think I have done my last Enable and mod podge treatment.
I just did a pair of 126en and don't like the results,
just way to bright sounding you hear all the details
but just to much, I guess I lean toward a warmer sound,
enable is just way to in your face sounding to me.
It's always frustrating when a mod doesn't work in the actual listening. I have done a few Enabl jobs over the past three years and followed much of Ed's (Ed Fontaine) discussion.

As Bob said, and if you allow for some variance in application technique, I've found the result to take the "life" out of speaks as well. The same cannot be said for phase plugs. Phase plugs can make a silk purse out of a Pioneer 4 in. NSB.
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